There have been a lot of interesting and well thought out views by everyone that have replied to this subject. The comments of TAYLOR 55 were interesting in that with our extreme climate, a restoration of a Canadian body is cost prohibitive. Carl Stevenson noted 2 days ago, "especially in the case of a rare car" . One of my closest friends of the 60's purchased a new 1968 Biscayne, 427cu. in. 4spd. out of a dealership in Waterford, Ont. and the vehicle is sitting about 6 miles from my house, outside, and has so for many years ; a rusted hulk. The individual that owns it has the protectoplate for the car with my friends name on it however it would be almost, ie almost, impossible to restore it the way it is. The question would be; do you let this car rust into the ground to the point of oblivion or do you rebody and whatever else to resurect the car? I haven't tried to purchase the car as I don't think I have enough time in my life to finish all the projects I do have however this vehicle is a relative local legend having been drag raced fairly extensively in the late 60's. To restore this it would likely take a complete floor, trunk floor, all supporting braces, front fenders, rear quarters, inner quarters, both bumpers, grille, all light assemblies, engine, tranny and all of the hundreds of small parts that we don't even think of, therefor the comments of both TAYLOR 55 and Carl Stevenson aforsaid certaily impact on the subject. It would stand to reason then that if you had two 1968 Biscaynes, or whatever, one would get the obviously more valuable serial numbers and the other car would disappear forever as there would be no value incentive to restore the second serial numbered car. Long winded, eh.
If there was a guarantee that some scammer wouldn't come along at some point in the "new" (re-VIN'd) car's life and try to make a fortune on it, the idea would be great. The sad reality is, you are honest, I am honest, the next owner is honest, but 5 guys down the line is a con man.
I will try to make my next story short! It's somewhat related to this topic:
In 1990, I bought an 87 Buick Grand National. It came from a salvage auction. The car only had 18,975 km on it. A city transit bus had T-boned it in the passenger side from the door back. The pass door, pass 1/4, floor and even drivers 1/4 were buckled from the impact. The frame was bent, along with the diff housing and right axle. However, I got the car at a good price. My brother had repaired a number of "G" body wrecks like this by grafting a roof, floor and rear clip from one car to another. All you do it cut the windshield pillars and the floor straight across in front of the front seats. We did this to this car, using a very nice Regal donor car. So far, all good, right?
We owned this car 9 years. I had my eyes on a 94 Impala SS. I had a sale arranged for the GN. It was a friend who works for GM in Winnipeg who had full knowledge of the cars history. However, due to a serious illness in his family, he passed on buying the car. It was a nice day when I went to look at the SS, so I drove the GN. The corner car lot owner loved the GN and we struck a deal, trading it for the SS. I told him about the car's history and explained the damage by going around the car with him. Two days later he delivered the Impala to my hometown, and again we went over the history of the car. So far, all good, right?
A couple of months later, I get a call from a guy in Winnipeg who is friends with a performance shop owner. The shop owner has bought my old GN at a dealer auction. This other guy recognizes my car, and knows the history. He tells the shop owner. The owner wants to know the history. I tell him it was a write off with a $21,000 repair estimate. He has a cow, and I don't blame him. It was sold through the auction with no disclosure. He gave the guy 10 days to get his money back to him and pick up the car, which did happen.
Few months later, I get the same call. This guy hasn't bought the car yet, but somehow has found out about the history, fortunately. He has no interest in buying a write off.
Now, this car might as well have been a re-bodied car. The only original metal was the fenders and hood and the drivers door. Basically from the dash back was different. It was a beautiful car, and very nicely done. No issues. However, it had NO info on the title stating it ever had even suffered a dent, never mind $21,000 damage. I went as far as to call our insurance company (in Manitoba there is only one choice, it's government insurance) and try to get the title "branded" showing the write off to prevent this hassle. They refused to do it. I had a total of 4 or 5 calls about this car before it finally sold to someone who in turn sold it to someone in Calgary. Wonder if he told the whole story.........................
That is why I say I have no problem with it if only everyone was honest.
And that's my "short" version of this story!!!!!!!!!!
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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles
1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars
I'm totally against the selling/buying of VINs ... it puts a bad name on classic car dealing, and makes one very sceptical to what pure cars are really out there. I don't mind repairs to classic cars to a certain extent ... but even with that, I think there should be a line drawn when stating a car is "original" afterwards. Where you draw that line is another thing. In the end, honesty is needed in the hobby.
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Prince Edward Island
'64 Parisienne CS "barn find" - last on the road in '86 ... Owner Protection Plan booklet, original paint, original near-mint aqua interior, original aqua GM floor mats, original 283, factory posi, and original rust.
I tried this once before and my computer screwed me around , or, I didn't know what I was doing: obiously the latter of the two is the most accurate. Anyway, the one car that comes to mind is the 1969 Pontiac 427-4spd in Selkirk, Ont. The frame appears to be, from the pictures posted on this site, to be in extremely poor condition. The price of the car compared to the PEI car is at the very least, double what it should be, compared to what will be required to restore the car. Now; do you reframe this vehicle or attempt to reconstruct what is there? I have noticed that those that oppose this option either do not own a collectible car or do not own a car worth restoring, or they can't aford a vehicle of this calibre. By the way, the individual that purchased the PEI 1968 427 car; wow, have you got a car. I thought about it and I have the money however I am getting old and have a lot of projects. If you need any parts I just ran into an individual this weekend that has a ton of 1968 parts and I haven't even looked at them yet. I've lost my train of thought, obiously my age. Thanks, Doug.
I have a cowl tag here from my first beaumont a 67 custom two door hardtop with bucket seats-I have the ownership too ! its worth something ? I scrapped the car in 1984 and just keep it for sentimental reasons
I see no harm in someone duplicating the only Z16 Chevelle convertible ever made. It's when they attach a VIN and cowl tag that prove it's genuine that I have a problem with that. I don't care if they owned the one and only Z16 convert at some point in their life and still have the tags to attach. It still isn't the original car and someone will pay for it thinking it is. That's fraud.
However, if you want to put those tags on another 67 Custom 2 door hardtop and make it look identical to your first car you had, what does it matter? Those tags won't make the car worth any more to anyone else.
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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles
1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars
No, I won't be doing that-too honest for that-thats why I'm not rich, I rebodied a 68 SS 396 chevelle once then didn't have the heart to change the tags-its a six cylinder car tags and all, but man it has everything from the old SS, and the SS tags went to the wreckers on the remaining shell-Canadian documented-guess there worth someting too !
I see a 57 chev on kijiji in Oakville no tags/no ownership-bet its a tough sell !
That sounds just like the 64 "GTO" I mentioned a few posts up. I had an opportunity years ago for tags off a wrecked GTO convert. Actually, even had 2 opportunities. Not only did I want to take a chance doing what some say is illegal (jury seems to be out on that one if it actually is or not) but I had no desire to make it that authentic. Sure, I wanted it to be tough to tell if it was real or not, until you looked at the tags.
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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles
1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars
