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Post Info TOPIC: What if I'm restoring a Matador Red car and don't like Matador red?


Poncho Master!

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What if I'm restoring a Matador Red car and don't like Matador red?


The title kind of summarizes the only thing I'm not 100% stoked about my current restoration, really, and that's just a result of the fact that Matador Red was really the only red you could order in 1969.  Pretty much every original Matador Red 1969 I've seen has been repainted a different red, and this one is no exception, it's had 3-4 different reds on it over time.

Basically, Matador Red is too purple/maroon/dark for my tastes.  So I really have three choices:

1) Suck it up, you bought a rare car to restore to stock, so learn to like it, dummy!

2) Paint it a color so close to Matador Red (like 1967 Regimental Red) that no one would know, but with less blue in the formula

3) Screw you all, I'll paint it whatever color I like, it's my car!

 

All three are perfectly valid options, but I still think I'll still wind up with #1... it's the right thing to do on a car like this!  Still, if I were to pick a totally custom color, which I doubt will happen, I'd pick 2018 Honda Red.  It'a bright, pure red without a bunch of orange (like my red 2015 Corvette, very orange Torch Red, like our Carousel almost).

This is my old 2+2 convertible, very similar except it had a black interior.  So I imagine it'll look close to this, which isn't that bad!

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Poncho Master!

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I say its just paint and do what you want. like and enjoy your car while you are its caregiver. Let the next person figure it out.

Original colours

Ermine white/saddle tan roof & saddle tan interior

before.png

Now

Custom Blue Raspberry Metallic / Ermine white roof - 1959 Aqua interior with custom cloth inserts

after.jpeg

Building for us and our tastes to get the most enjoyment out of this ride. Not hacked so anyone wanting to do a correct restoration in the future may do so if they please.

 

 

 



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Poncho Master!

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I might be biased but I like Matador Red.

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'68 Parisienne 2+2 Convertible Matador Red (Resale Red but not for sale).



Poncho Master!

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Well if it was up to me (and I suppose it is) it'd be Warwick blue with a blue interior and white top, but they never made any such combination!











-- Edited by davepl on Thursday 8th of March 2018 12:44:27 PM

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Guru

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I personally love to keep things original.

But the previous owner changed the colour a bit and several CP members have told me not to change it back.

008a.jpg

It is very close to the colour I chose in the 80s to paint my Grande

69 Grande back.jpg

 

 

 



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Randy(Muttwood)

ga


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if youâre putting it s museum when youâre finished the resto go original if youâre going to drive and enjoy it go with whatever you like. itâs your car. seems a shame to go to all that work not to have exactly what you want

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The Imperial City, Sarnia, Ontario



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Matador Red is a very nice color when done right (but it is rarely done right). It is aptly named as it is a blood red with a black edge to it. Most cars I see painted Matador get it wrong by having too much pink or orange instead of that black undercurrent.

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John

Montreal 

13 1969 American Pontiacs

and a 1969 Canadian 2+2



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choice# 3

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Poncho Master!

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Option number 2 or 3!

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Victoria, BC



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I'd go #3, but I'm a rebel wink

Will it be worth what you have into it when you are done if you do it original? will it be worth any less if you don't?

Yes it is a rare piece, and to some extent should be preserved that way, but who else would have done it? Probably no one, so do it the way that makes YOU happy. Not much point in doing it if you don't want to look at it after it's done because the colour bothers you. If nothing else go with a red you like. Other than the people here and maybe a dozen others who will know the difference?

Your car, you pay the bills, only have to please yourself.



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Stony Mountain, MB

65 Impala SS 2dr HT
65 Impala convert.
59 Impala 2dr HT
67 Acadian Canso 2dr HT

 

 

 



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When I got impala in 79 it was repainted the original colour When it was restored I chose a 68 Corvette dark blue. Some people identify the colour as original. IT IS NOT.... JUST MY CHOICE FOR MY ENJOYMENT. Go with your heart. It is YOUR car at the end of the day.

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When I did my 66 I had two or three (or four) things in mind when i decided to keep the original colour.

1 I liked it.

2 I'm lazy and didn't want the trouble (and expense) of a wholesale change considering the original colour was still on the firewall and was in good shape.

3. For a A Canadian Pontiac I don't think it pays to get too picky about numbers or colour correctness as the value of any Canadian Pontiac seems not to go above a certain level regardless

(I/e they seem to get a big yawn from really stupidly rich collectors)

4. I was planning to drive it a lot so total correctness wasn't going to last anyway.

Most guys at a show and shine don't know what is correct anyway and the few that do aren't that much fun to talk to and spent most of their time sitting by their car, sulking (This is why I get shunned probably.) heh heh

 

Just some random thoughts that may or may not help you think about it.   

 

 



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ken from northern Alberta

38 Willys pickup electric powered project

39 Buick (327 with 700 r4)

66 Grande Parisienne 396 with AC (built October 26 1965)

69 Chevy CST pickup

1976 GMC 23'  motorhome



Poncho Master!

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I think I'll spray a small panel matador red, then take my Torch Red Corvette and go look at a new Honda. Maybe seeing all three colors in proximity will speak to me!

I'm building the car accurate for myself, not for future value (which I assume there is none of). Which is kind of why I hate to digress on color shade. I'd never recolor it to a completely different color, I'll keep it red, but it might just wind up my favorite incorrect shade of red or dark red. I can always afford a color change to Matador if it became important for some reason.

There are no judges or collectors to impress that aren't on this board anyway, so if it doesn't offend you folks, it actually makes a difference.

I could live with the way they pictured Matador Red Catalina in the US Brochure.  I want a car that looks like that color!  Too bad its nothing like the color of the car they wound up selling.

CatalinaBrochureLeft[1].jpg

 



-- Edited by davepl on Thursday 8th of March 2018 03:02:53 PM

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Addicted!

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I'd work to matching a large factory colorchip from the 69 Dealer Sales Album. Modern colors just don't look "right" on stock looking 60's cars.

1969 Pontiac-12-13.jpg

 



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John

Montreal 

13 1969 American Pontiacs

and a 1969 Canadian 2+2



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Boy those US Pontiac ads were works of seductive art!

As for your plans it sounds as if you have thought this out and you know why you're doing what you're doing (which is something I cant say all that often.) 



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ken from northern Alberta

38 Willys pickup electric powered project

39 Buick (327 with 700 r4)

66 Grande Parisienne 396 with AC (built October 26 1965)

69 Chevy CST pickup

1976 GMC 23'  motorhome



A Poncho Legend!

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To me it's simple. If you are doing the car in a way that you want it to be worth the most $$$ in case you ever sell it, keep it original.

If you don't plan to sell it, do whatever you like the best, it's your car and you are paying for it so you have the right to thumb your nose at everyone who comments in a negative way!

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1966 Strato Chief 2 door sedan 283 "survivor"


Poncho Master!

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rth wrote:

I'd work to matching a large factory colorchip from the 69 Dealer Sales Album. Modern colors just don't look "right" on stock looking 60's cars.


I've never seen one, do you actually have the US one?  With the fabric swatches and all of that?

I'd sure love to have a Canadian one of those!  I wonder if they existed?

When searching for Broughams I found one that was custom ordered in Carousel Red.  I think that's WAY too bright of a color for big car like this.  And you're right most modern colors don't often look right, but then neither does base-clear!

Still, I'd love to know the story behind someone ordering a 1969 Bonneville Brougham Convertible with black leather in Carousel Red!

Pontiac_1969_Bonneville-428-Convertible_262679C114690_12.jpg



-- Edited by davepl on Thursday 8th of March 2018 05:04:02 PM



-- Edited by davepl on Thursday 8th of March 2018 05:06:11 PM

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A Poncho Legend!

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I've seen paint codes on cowl tags of course but sure never have seen the actual paint name on a cowl tag. Do you think it's legit? It sure does look original but wow, talk about something unique!

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1966 Strato Chief 2 door sedan 283 "survivor"


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Hello I went an lived every thing you are going through an thinking about it going back a forth trust me my car is a super rare color combo for my 1968 Beaumont 2 dr ht  Matador red white top an white int  have never even seen a other not even in a picture was siting on hold for years in the shop about 7 years thinking about that ugly red an looking at other reds no disrespect to the lady's .Last year I got it the car finished came out super nice an I have no regrets went with the 68 GROTTO BLUE everyone that has seen the car said I made the correct choice an when that cover comes off jaws drop. Don't worry about value you have to look at it an pay for it. Now this is a good one last year my motor started smoking so was looking for parts for a 327 large journal so went to see a guy that had a 68 Camaro rag that was that matador red ! The wife wanted the red he wanted the GROTTO BLUE she got her way you could tell he was not happy with it the wife pick she was standing with in the garage with us says it looked better on the chip an she could find cloth, nail polish an shoe's to match easy ! Now am sure I have offended you guys an women with the red cars I am truly sorry but I won't even put something on red an for about 10k paint job you better pick the color you want . 



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A Poncho Legend!

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The nice thing is, colour is strictly opinion/personal taste. It's great we don't all like the same thing or the cars would be boring!



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1966 Strato Chief 2 door sedan 283 "survivor"


Poncho Master!

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Carl Stevenson wrote:

I've seen paint codes on cowl tags of course but sure never have seen the actual paint name on a cowl tag. Do you think it's legit? It sure does look original but wow, talk about something unique!


I think it is - I'm no US expert but I decoded it as "special order paint" and the PPG/Ditzler code for Carousel Red is on there too.  Plus the car was painted black, so if they were going to fake something, you'd think they'd match the car!



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Uber Guru

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Personally i love Matador Red, i had a 56 Chev 210 from 1981-1984 that i painted that colour and loved it. My Matador Red was a bit more orange than yours though. Do what ever makes you happy brother. Cheers.



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1957 Pontiac Pathfinder Deluxe sedan restored 261 six

1974 Chevrolet Caprice Estate wagon low milage original 400 V-8



Poncho Master!

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I wonder why, on the Catalina page, they show two different Catalinas in two different reds. By that I mean the two door is a bright red and the four door looks like Matador, but there -was- no bright red.

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Looks like there were 2 reds available for the US?  Matador and Carousel?  But wasn't Carousel that orangy-red that was popular on GTO?  The Catalina hardtop doesn't look that 'orangy', so it is puzzling.

1969-Pontiac-pg01.jpg

This is just my opinion, but if your intention is to restore, and given the car's rarity, I'd choose the original colour.  Mind you, I like Matador Red, so it would be an easy choice for me.

But, as people have mentioned, it's your car, your money, your efforts, and in the end it should make you happy.  Probably the best compromise IMHO would be to paint it another 1969 Pontiac colour that appeals to you more, then it would still be restored to an original colour, just not the colour the car was born with.  That would be a better choice than, say, that bright Mopar lime green (Sublime/Limelight) or something else that would tip the scales from restoration to hot rod or custom.

That said, if you want to build a hot rod, then go for it - again, your money your car.

Either way you are saving a car that probably would have rotted away eventually and been lost forever.  Thanks for your contribution to the Canadian Pontiac hobby!



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Addicted!

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I think the other red in the Catalina brochure is supposed to be burgundy.

My body man who painted a GTO for me decades ago in it's Matador red liked it so much he recently painted his 32 Ford hotrod with the same color. Back then i was using Sikkens and they had the color wrong for 69 Pontiac. But the exact same color was used in 70 for Oldsmobile and for some reason Sikkens had the right mix if you ordered it for a 70 Cutlass.

 

Here is Matador Red from my 1969 Dealer sales Album.  The background color was the incorrect Burgundy that I had to reshoot.

 

2017-10-17 061.JPG



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John

Montreal 

13 1969 American Pontiacs

and a 1969 Canadian 2+2

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