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Blazin


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electrical trouble shooting 101
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Woked on my Beaumont this weekend, thought I would post the story. I was tired of starting my car with a screwdriver, jumping the terminals on the solinoid. The car would start fine unless I was in the company of other collector cars, then out came the screwdriver,,,,nice. This has been going on for the last month, Saturday was the day to fix it.

Bought a new starter solinoid and then removed the starter, Lordco sold me the wrong solinoid, off to Lordco to exchange it, wait in line to find out they do not have the correct one and cannot get until monday. I figure I can take the part off the old one and put it on the new one and all will be fine. I do that, re install the starter and,,,, no go. What the %&%&%$%&&. I bring out the wife to turn the key while check for power at the S terminal with a test light. There is power at the terminal when the key is turned to the start position. So,,,, starter no good?? maybe I messed up the solinoid when I took it appart.

Off to Lordco again. buy a new starter with solinoid. I get home open it up, drag it under thye car and,,,, wrong starter %^%$&^%&. Off to Lordco again, this time with the old starter in hand, wait in line, make the exchange and get the right starter.

Get home and install the correct starter, which went quickly as I am becoming somewhat of an expert at this. The moment of truth,,turn the key and ,,,,,nothing &*&*%^%^. What can be wrong??? I check the connections, they are all good, there is power at the S terninal.

I pull the ignition switch and take off the harness plug. jump a couple of wires across the terminals and varoom. Turns out the ignition switch was only sending a couple volts to the solinoid, not enough to engage, but enough to light up the test light.
I just gave Lordco a fairly new starter with a new solinoid as a core.

I will try find a new switch tomorrow, I see it is a GTO switch. One thing I did notice was with no experience, I hot wired the car in a few minutes, the details to do this were on the back of the switch. Not much security, I am sure this coud be done in less than a minute. I am sure there is a lesson or two in all of this.

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4SPEED427


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As I was reading your story, I was going to suggest checking voltage at the "S". Then I read it all. Rats!!! I could have been a hero in diagnosing it correctly!!!

My 65 Acadian was doing this as well but I have never been able to find out where the voltage drop is. It's somewhere in the harness, switch to solenoid, so once it's back on the road I plan to rip and tear till I find the area that is bad.

I think the lesson in this, at least one of them, is to install some kind of security in your car like a kill switch of some sort.

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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles 

1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars (now converted to a "factory" 4 speed)
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67BBSD


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my deepwater blue 67 SD had that problem-never found it,

clearly times were different 40 years ago-we weren't as concerned someone would steal our car !

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Elroy


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For those cars that aren't starting and have proper voltage; Some of the big blocks had a problem with the manifolds heating the solenoids to the point they would not engage. There was a campaign change, mostly for 427 truck engines that put a relay on the firewall that aleviated the problem. A lot of smallblocks with headers can experience the same problem. There was also a heatshield with this campaign that protected the solenoid. I wish I remembered the part nos, Carl maybe you can help ??

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Beaumont4008


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My buddy's 67 chevelle did the same thing, we changed everthing. Nothing fixed it. Instead of jumping it with a screw driver he wired in a jumper to a remote push button switch under the hood. I never liked this and tryed to convince him to wire in a remote solinoid from M.A.D. ent. but would not here it. Did not want a ford part on his car.    Hear is what M.A.D says about the problem;

see link for solinoid kit  ( same as a ford )

GM HOT START PROBLEMS

There are two independent categories of hot start problems with the GM DELCO built starting system.

(1)  Nothing happens when the key is turned to "START"although the headlights will burn brightly, and the rest of the electrical system is fine.  The problem most often occurs in hot weather, and with the engine warmed up, after about a ten-minute stop.  (Heat increases resistance at wiring and electrical parts.)

This is the type of problem, which will be cured with installation of the START'M UP kit.  The problem occurs because the large solenoid on the GM starter draws 40 to 50 amps at the moment the key is turned to "START."   And that large amount of current must flow through a very lengthy circuit, from the battery to the dash area.  Through dash wiring and switches, back out through the under-hood wiring, finally to the starter.

The START'M UP kit will reduce current flow through the lengthy circuit to only 2 ampsthen the system will work fine.

 http://www.madelectrical.com/catalog/st-1.shtml

-- Edited by Beaumont4008 on Monday 31st of August 2009 11:50:07 AM

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Elroy


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GM made a kit too, my 427 car actually has it. I will post a photo, its a relay not a Ford solenoid...

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4SPEED427


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On my Acadian I just wired in a basic Ford solenoid down low on the inner apron near the starter where it was hard to see. Worked perfect. I have now eliminated the wiring for that. When (if) I get that 327 built and put it, I WILL find the cure for this trouble!

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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles 

1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars (now converted to a "factory" 4 speed)
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2drpost


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never ever had a starter heat soak problem.

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im2ner


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my 67 cutlass had same issue , it always started cold , but after 10-15min of run time it would not restart unless jumped @ s terminal

The ignition switch was the problem ... voltage is run through the switch ( not sure witch terminals , o dont have a wiring diagram to look at ) -- there was small amount of corrosion in the switch , so after voltage was run through for a bit it would build higher resistence ..... aka no start

you can replace the switch or run the start wire to a relay & run the relay wire to S terminal

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Blazin


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Nice to see I am not alone at this. I see that there have been problems with heat, interesting that the problem mostly came about when the car was hot.

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ak 67sd


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I run a remote solenoid on my car... its been on there since i first put it together, havent tried without it to see if its solving any problems, but i have not had a hot start problem.

ak

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