I'm new to this forum and to the 'Poncho' world, but not new to cars (classic or new). The old man and I are currently restoring a '69 Chevy Malibu and I've got a number of other mildly interesting cars that I play around with.
Recently, and rather unfortunately/unexpectedly, my 'uncle' (dad's first cousin) passed away. He was a huge car guy and him and I were always talking about cars, especially ever since I started workout out in Milford at GM's Proving Grounds, and it looks like at least one of his cars will be making its way to me - a 1964 Parisienne Custom Sport Hardtop Coupe (7447). I don't know much about the car besides some digging I've just done and some additional info I had from him when he was still around.
It looks like he bought the car at an auction quite a few years ago from the original purchaser's family, and that's about the extent of the paper trail. I never saw the car move but he swore it would start right up...if he could get to it under all the junk he buried it under over the years.
Now, I did briefly see the car in person this past weekend and as he had told me, the car had been painted maroon by the PO over the original white. The interior is all original, with excellent condition white/parchment vinyl buckets and rear bench. The body overall is solid with no visible rust and even the seams of the floor and trunk pan are incredibly clean. The rear windshield is smashed/gone and the front has a huge crater in - both will need to be replaced. As far as I know, all the trim is on or in the car.
The garage it's in is barely bigger than the car and the tires are all flat and so the car is very low to the ground with little room to move around. I am planning to go back this weekend to jack it up a bit and possibly pull it out to look around more/get more pictures (which I will be happy to share here). What I'm hoping for is some advice of what to look for, especially on the underside, to see if this car is salvageable/worth keeping. Just looking at the body and interior, I'd say so, but from the quick glance I took underneath, I saw exhaust hanging/dropped, and some sort of brace? that was rotted/rotting out real bad. It looked like it might have been one of the body braces that holds the cage nuts for the seats as it ran widthwise along the car. I didn't get a good look due to the space it was in but that's what this coming weekend is for.
The car is in the Greater Toronto Area, so if there is a 'resident expert' that would be willing to make themselves available to check the car out with me it would be much appreciated. I will likely be going to see it on Saturday.
The body tag is:
Style: 7447 1-6-16
Body No: 793211
Paint: C
Trim: 275
---: M35
It is a V8 car (didn't get the numbers yet) and obviously a powerglide car based on the M35 above. It has non-power brakes (small, wire retention MC with one line) and power steering. I put in a rush order for the info from George at the Heritage Centre so that I could have a better idea of what I'm looking at this weekend.
I was just gonna say yes it is (because of the cowl tag info) but now I get what you mean, the picture Carl posted is a Parisienne, not a Custom Sport.
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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles
1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars
Good stuff G-Force! Welcome to the CS club! I can't physically help you, do to the distance, but I do have some CS parts if needed.
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Prince Edward Island
'64 Parisienne CS "barn find" - last on the road in '86 ... Owner Protection Plan booklet, original paint, original near-mint aqua interior, original aqua GM floor mats, original 283, factory posi, and original rust.
Thanks for the warm welcome! It seems like a very tight-knit community on here and I'm happy to be a part of it. For all those itching for some pictures - I will have them for you guys this weekend :) Hopefully I can get it back to looking like the one in Double_D's picture!
Urban_Suburban, I will send you a PM.
What should I be looking for on the X-Frame/underside of the car to determine how far gone (or not) the car is? Also, how hard is it to find replacement front and rear windshields? Do I just ask for '64 Chevy Impala glass? Are all the mechanicals/underpinnings the same parts as a '64 Impala?
Yes, if you lift the body off the frame, you have an Impala. Make sure that any parts you order for the chassis are ordered for Impala to avoid confusion. Some parts guys know it, and some sure don't!
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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles
1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars
What should I be looking for on the X-Frame/underside of the car to determine how far gone (or not) the car is?
The back third of the car is the most rust prone. Look at the trunk floor/rear body mounts/wheel housings/rear frame, they are the best indicators of how solid the car is.
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Prince Edward Island
'64 Parisienne CS "barn find" - last on the road in '86 ... Owner Protection Plan booklet, original paint, original near-mint aqua interior, original aqua GM floor mats, original 283, factory posi, and original rust.
Thanks for the advice - will check all those spots out.
Here's the vehicle report:
Looks like it was a pretty bare bones CS Coupe. One thing I noticed that stands out is that this car originally had power brakes, it does not as it currently sits.
-- Edited by GForceJunky on Tuesday 10th of October 2017 01:43:22 PM
-- Edited by GForceJunky on Tuesday 10th of October 2017 01:44:01 PM
-- Edited by GForceJunky on Tuesday 10th of October 2017 01:49:53 PM
Floors, floor braces, rockers inner and outer, and what Darryl said. Check for bondo in the rear quarters and door bottoms. Nice car potentially.
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63 Parisienne sport coupe (The Big GTO), black, maroon interior, 409 4 speed; former owner of a 59 El Camino, 63 Corvette SWC, 62 Chev Bel Air SC. 1963- Pontiac top selling car in Canada
Mahone Bay, NS Still not old enough to need an automatic
Floors, floor braces, rockers inner and outer, and what Darryl said. Check for bondo in the rear quarters and door bottoms. Nice car potentially.
Thanks, will check all these spots. From my quick check last weekend, the entire body (that I could access, so half the car) seems solid - will take a magnet to it but I felt around and looked (I was trained professionally to look for body imperfections in a previous job) and did not notice anything. From inside the car (interior, trunk, etc.) all the floor/trunk pan sheet metal seems solid and the seams where they join the body are showing relatively rust free on the interior. I do believe at least one of the floor braces is rotted/rotting out but I'll see more this weekend.
norontcan wrote:
Another Rumble car. This certainly has lots of potential. Keep your fingers crossed.
They've been crossed since this all started! Was Rumble known for selling a lot of Parisiennes/CS Cars? We're local to Rumble, so my dad/family all remember it - it was gone before I ever came around, or at least before I can remember it.
Upper body looks good (poorly done paint job) but underneath it's pretty rough in areas. Although most of the floor is/looks solid, you can see a lot of the braces are rotting out and the drivers side floor where the brace is/was is rotted out and exposing the carpet. The frame seemed relatively solid though rusty but I didn't probe too much as I was pressed for time and the weather was turning so I wanted to get in and out quickly.
Engine bay seems fine as does the suspension; note the lack of a brake booster and the single brake line MC. The front wheels rotate freely when the car is jacked up, so that's a good start. The interior seems to be fairly intact albeit dirty.
Forgot to take pictures of the trunk but that's where any missing trim pieces are/should be.
Let me know what you guys think and if it's worth bothering with? Is it better relegated to becoming a parts car or would you guys save it? Time, more than anything else, is my limiting factor (although money is a factor as well) and given that I already have a few project cars I only want to head down this path if it seems reasonable.
So I guess my question to you would be "Is this model and make of car one of your favorites?" I think how you answer that will determine how much you want to put into this car because it definitely needs lots of time and money thrown at it. Sometimes if a person gets a real good deal or in your case an inheritance you feel somewhat obligated to fix it up but in the end it can add up and unless you are really excited about that certain car it may not be worth it.
Unless you do your own body work, that's a very expensive car to repair. It likely needs most of the floor, most floor braces, inner and outer quarters and rockers, likely a lot of trunk work and the lip under the rear bumper. Bottoms of front fenders, and how are the trunk lid and the bonnet, likely rusty?
I wouldn't buy it judging by your pictures, its likely a parts car IMHO.
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63 Parisienne sport coupe (The Big GTO), black, maroon interior, 409 4 speed; former owner of a 59 El Camino, 63 Corvette SWC, 62 Chev Bel Air SC. 1963- Pontiac top selling car in Canada
Mahone Bay, NS Still not old enough to need an automatic
At the risk of sounding negative, I strongly believe that Don and Jerel have said what needs to be said. I have owned my '64 CS ragtop for 42 years. As Don said, it is "a very expensive car to repair." Judging by the pictures, I would suggest that you are looking at a minimum of $50,000 to make this car look great. These figures are modest to say the least. Remember . . . there are two kinds of levers - - - Lever A and Lever B.
So I guess my question to you would be "Is this model and make of car one of your favorites?" I think how you answer that will determine how much you want to put into this car because it definitely needs lots of time and money thrown at it. Sometimes if a person gets a real good deal or in your case an inheritance you feel somewhat obligated to fix it up but in the end it can add up and unless you are really excited about that certain car it may not be worth it.
DonSSDD wrote:
Unless you do your own body work, that's a very expensive car to repair. It likely needs most of the floor, most floor braces, inner and outer quarters and rockers, likely a lot of trunk work and the lip under the rear bumper. Bottoms of front fenders, and how are the trunk lid and the bonnet, likely rusty?
I wouldn't buy it judging by your pictures, its likely a parts car IMHO.
Pritch wrote:
At the risk of sounding negative, I strongly believe that Don and Jerel have said what needs to be said. I have owned my '64 CS ragtop for 42 years. As Don said, it is "a very expensive car to repair." Judging by the pictures, I would suggest that you are looking at a minimum of $50,000 to make this car look great. These figures are modest to say the least. Remember . . . there are two kinds of levers - - - Lever A and Lever B.
norontcan wrote:
Certainly not for the faint of heart . One would need skill, lots of parts and even more money to bring this one back.
Unless it has special meaning or sentimental value best left for its parts.
This car won't cost me anything to acquire besides what I've spent on the paperwork from George and my time, at least thus far, so that isn't an issue. There is definitely some sentimental value, though not a huge amount because I had never even seen this car before my uncle passed and it was always his Corvettes (he had a few) that we bonded over and chatted about most. In general, I am all about recovering and restoring things as much as possible and hate to see things (not limited to just cars, but cars especially) go to waste but my resources are a little limited right now. I do have at least some of the skills and most of the tools necessary to do the work and am developing more and better skills as I go through the rigours of a nut-and-bolt/rotisserie restoration on my '69 Malibu, combined with all my experience building and racing cars, but I am VERY short on time, somewhat limited on funds (new house in the works, multiple project cars, etc.), and also very short on space. I don't even know where I'd put this thing, let alone have the space and time to actually dig into it.
Do they make replacement sheet metal? Are there half-decent floor pans, rockers, etc. out there or would this all be custom fab? I definitely do not have the time for this much custom fab work...I could maybe consider keeping it if there is reasonable aftermarket support available. I enjoy the process and would take it on if I were further on in life and had more time (I'm only 27 and spend my time back and forth between Michigan and Ontario) available. As far as CS Couples go, it is also a pretty bare bones/basic car, and not as desirable as say a convertible or a big block car or a manual trans car, etc.
If it were to end up being a parts car, what would some of this stuff be worth? The interior is in fairly good shape, the hood, trunk lid, doors, side glass, most trim, etc. is also in fairly decent shape. The motor isn't anything special but it ran. The tranny and rear end were working when it was put away. Pulling this thing apart wouldn't be an issue, though it would be a little sad...but if I can help keep other cars on the road and in good shape then I'm definitely open to it!
Thanks for all the feedback everyone - really appreciate the openness and honesty. =)
-- Edited by GForceJunky on Monday 16th of October 2017 10:30:11 PM
-- Edited by GForceJunky on Monday 16th of October 2017 10:30:33 PM
The floor pans are reproduced (all 1 piece with braces installed, or separate pans or separate braces), as they are Chevy (61-64), likely anything you need for trunk work too and rockers. Quarters are not reproduced, you'd need to fab them or find good used stuff, which you likely can. Drag it home and clean it out, see what all the parts are like for say chrome pitting, seats, door panels all usable, etc. then you can get an idea about parts value.
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63 Parisienne sport coupe (The Big GTO), black, maroon interior, 409 4 speed; former owner of a 59 El Camino, 63 Corvette SWC, 62 Chev Bel Air SC. 1963- Pontiac top selling car in Canada
Mahone Bay, NS Still not old enough to need an automatic
