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Poncho Master!

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Wilwoods on a Pontiac


On my "not stock" car.  Still not sensitive enough for me... I'm after that super-sensitive 1970s disc brake feel, but cannot get it for some reason!

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Guru

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Nice I have same on mine only difference I went with hydro-boost 

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Poncho Master!

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I've had a hydro-boost on it in the past, before the Wildwoods, and didn't find I got much more assist out of it. I'm pretty much at a loss at this point since everything is new and it's no different. Other than fade, I think I preferred the four-wheel drum for the response/feel!

Basically, I'd like them responsive enough that if you "kicked" the pedal it might chirp the front tires. I know you could do that with the stock discs in my blue 2+2, but why my car is slow to respond to the pedal I've never figured out. And it's been through a complete frame-off and now a Wilwood upgrade, still no joy!




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Poncho Master!

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Lack of asbestos in pads I reckon....



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cutting a roof off a four door is NOT a convertible.....

65 Parisienne convertible project.



A Poncho Legend!

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Why not go back to stock GM system then?

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LOL. I spotted the problem. You have to connect the vacuum hose to the booster

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A Poncho Legend!

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Front of the class for you Randy!

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1966 Strato Chief 2 door sedan 283 4 speed 43,000 miles


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ashmore wrote:

LOL. I spotted the problem. You have to connect the vacuum hose to the booster


... and install the wheels.blankstare 



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'64 Parisienne CS "barn find" - last on the road in '86 ... Owner Protection Plan booklet, original paint, original near-mint aqua interior, original aqua GM floor mats, original 283, factory posi, and original rust.



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davepl wrote:

I've had a hydro-boost on it in the past, before the Wildwoods, and didn't find I got much more assist out of it. I'm pretty much at a loss at this point since everything is new and it's no different. Other than fade, I think I preferred the four-wheel drum for the response/feel!

Basically, I'd like them responsive enough that if you "kicked" the pedal it might chirp the front tires. I know you could do that with the stock discs in my blue 2+2, but why my car is slow to respond to the pedal I've never figured out. And it's been through a complete frame-off and now a Wilwood upgrade, still no joy!



       We put Hydro boost on my grandsons truck and it will lock and slide the front tires .   

       I've had over 100 old cars, and Never had one that would chirp the tires if I touched/kicked the pedal.... 

       I did see it on old power drum brake Dodges 



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Poncho Master!

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I've had two that I thought had "great, fast response" that I'd like to achieve: a 1969 Pontiac 2+2 w/discs and a 1970 Impala Custom w/discs, which I think are pretty much the same car under the covers. Both had really responsive brakes.

Now as for "best braking" that'd be my pedestrian old 1997 BMW 528i, the first new car I ever owned. But I'm trying to be realistic, so shooting for a lower bar!

Basically, if I stab the pedal as hard as I can, like if a dog runs in front, there's a "delay" like you're pushing fluid through too-small of an orifice somewhere. But you're not. Then within a second it makes great stopping power, it's just the "delay" I don't like. But no one else can see it, only me. It's like the Emperor's New Brakes.


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Poncho Master!

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Dave, only thing I can think of, are there or is there a residual pressure valves in use? Normally they are needed on applications where the master cylinder is mounted low in the chassis. I'm just wondering if the hysteresis in the rubber piston seals is drawing the pistons back ever so slightly after a brake application. Pretty easy to check as a disc brake is "supposed" to have some drag at all times. Willwood makes the residual pressure valves for disc and drum brakes.

I hope you get your brakes sorted out to your satisfaction.

Eric

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Eric - Regina, SK

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1967 Mustang Convertible

1969 Firebird 350HO Convertible

1969 Camaro X11-V8

1969 GTO sold

1969 2+2 was a 396

1969 2+2 427

1978 Chev ShortBox StepSide 4x4

1980 Harley FXWG

1986 CJ7 Jeep

 



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What sized bore is your master? How much pedal travel do you get? Is the pedal stiff?

Correctly sizing the master can bring you to the proper point of brake pressure vs pedal travel. Perhaps you're not building proper pressure?

Mine stops well, but the pedal hardly moves and is very stiff. I have a 1 1/8" master and would like to go down to a 1". This would let the pedal travel further, feel lighter and build higher pressure with less effort.

I have big Wilwoods up front, and drums in the back. I found that brake feel improved greatly by correctly adjusting a bias valve I'd installed in the rear line. In the beginning I wasn't really even using the rears, and after adjusting it to the point that the rears are just about locking up on hard stops, the feel improved. Perhaps your rears are not really adding anything to the equation? I see you have one, have you played with that?

You could do a pressure test at all 4 corners and see what you get.

Another thing to try would be some different pads.



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67' Grande Parisienne. Ex Ottawa USSR Embassy car, 67- 68.
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Hey Dave. I dont know nothin about your brakes but I just wanted to say that your car looks amazing in every pic Ive seen. That 69 L36/M20 convertible is sure in good hands! Since we will be going down similar paths in restoring similar cars, I hope you dont mind me calling on you from time to time asking to borrow some of your experience.

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Poncho Master!

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Thanks! I didn't do the restoration on the black car, that was Musclecar Restorations. I am considering using them for the bodywork on this one, but haven't decided yet. I need to see the car and see where I'm at!  I did the restoration on the GMC (MCR did the paint) and I'll be more authentic on this one if I can!



-- Edited by davepl on Monday 1st of January 2018 07:24:35 PM

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A Poncho Legend!

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I could come down, and drive it for you, while you hang over sides, and figure out whats cooking .  lol . 



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Poncho Master!

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When I installed C3 brakes on all 4 corners of my '66 Strato Chief, I basically replicated GM's JL8 system, that thing stopped better than my '11 Ram at the time. It was pretty straight forward. No aftermarket pieces were used in the re-creation. Car was a rush to drive.......

-- Edited by rebelrouser on Thursday 4th of January 2018 09:34:21 PM

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Poncho Master!

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I had GM calipers all the way around. Those were the FIRST to go in the garbage. Sure, if I could find GM JL8 stuff I would, but 99% of what you find are mid-80s GM Cadillac pieces that tend to leak and require continual adjustment. I don't know how Cadillac owners put up with them!

That's why I switched to Wilwood. I'd already switched to disc and was unhappy with the quality, so upgraded the weak stuff. It was not actually in pursuit of better braking, it was to ditch the Caddy pieces.  What really surprised me was how much the SAME it was with the new Wilwood master and capiers at all four corners.  You'd imagine it'd have to be different!

 



-- Edited by davepl on Wednesday 3rd of January 2018 12:02:09 PM

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