1969 Trivia and 1970 Changes

davepl · Poncho Master!

1969 Trivia and 1970 Changes

Howmac · Guru

I had a 69 427/335 Impala - (Canadian built with GM documentation) that was ordered with the F41 . ( should be the same as Pontiac you would think, unless Pontiac chose not to offer the F41 option)

davepl · Poncho Master!

I've got documentary info that the F41 was L36-only for 1969, if you or anyone can show F41 could be ordered with the LS1 motor, that'd be an interesting contraction. Anyone have a link to an Impala order form or accessorizer?

Howmac · Guru

Here is the GM documentation clearly showing F41 ordered with a LS1 engine . St. Therese Built Impala .

The 2+2 's were built in the same plant so it would be interesting if Pontiac's were "restricted" in the options available , considering the suspension and power trains were all Chevrolet

North · Guru

Interesting, the next step is to see if someone has a non L36 69 poncho with F41. The factory docs make it clear you couldnt order F41 without the L36 but I agree it seems odd that it was possible on the mechanically identical chevy.

As for corrections on your list with the US cars you could order any cluster combo except extra warning light option combined with auxiliary gauges. In other words you could order just warning light option or warning light option with speed warning too.

-- Edited by North on Tuesday 6th of February 2018 08:13:36 PM

seventy2plus2 · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

davepl wrote:
I've got documentary info that the F41 was L36-only for 1969, if you or anyone can show F41 could be ordered with the LS1 motor, that'd be an interesting contraction. Anyone have a link to an Impala order form or accessorizer?

I think your spell checker went a little wild with "documented" & "contradiction".

davepl · Poncho Master!

North wrote:
Interesting, the next step is to see if someone has a non L36 69 poncho with F41. The factory docs make it clear you couldnt order F41 without the L36 but I agree it seems odd that it was possible on the mechanically identical chevy.

As for corrections on your list with the US cars you could order any cluster combo except extra warning light option combined with auxiliary gauges. In other words you could order just warning light option or warning light option with speed warning too.

So the FUEL - BELTS - LIGHTS option was available in the US? I didn't actually know that. I thought that was a Canadian innovation for some reason (an adapted Chevy feature).

427carl · A Poncho Legend!

1969 Impala documents .JPG

Canadian Poncho · A Poncho Legend!

Wow- 1991. Looks like they created those on a Commodore 64!

67Poncho · Uber Guru

Howmac wrote:
Here is the GM documentation clearly showing F41 ordered with a LS1 engine . St. Therese Built Impala .
The 2+2 's were built in the same plant so it would be interesting if Pontiac's were "restricted" in the options available , considering the suspension and power trains were all Chevrolet

I could be reading this in the incorrect context but the 2+2's were built in Oshawa.. Again, I could be reading this wrong... blankstare

-- Edited by 67Poncho on Tuesday 6th of February 2018 09:50:42 PM

427carl · A Poncho Legend!

67Poncho wrote:
Howmac wrote:
Here is the GM documentation clearly showing F41 ordered with a LS1 engine . St. Therese Built Impala .
The 2+2 's were built in the same plant so it would be interesting if Pontiac's were "restricted" in the options available , considering the suspension and power trains were all Chevrolet
I could be reading this in the incorrect context but the 2+2's were built in Oshawa.. Again, I could be reading this wrong...

4SPEED427 · A Poncho Legend!

We've seen a documented 68 2+2 F41 car with a 396. Not sure if that really helps here though but figured I'd toss out the reminder.

davepl · Poncho Master!

Carl Stevenson wrote:
We've seen a documented 68 2+2 F41 car with a 396. Not sure if that really helps here though but figured I'd toss out the reminder.

We have? Can you point me at that sheet? I've got all the ones above but don't have that one in my collection. It's a 1968 anyway, not a 69, I just collect the sheets.

As noted, F41 requires L36 in the Pontiac. Heck, you could even have a 69 Impala built in Oshawa with it, that'd be interesting, but it doesn't give the Pontiac the Impala's hidden headlight option either!

Notice all those sheets and somehow mine remains the only documented rally wheel car I've ever seen. Forget the L36/F41/M20/convertible bit, it's the rallys! Why did no one order them, they're so nice!

-- Edited by davepl on Wednesday 7th of February 2018 11:24:27 AM

4SPEED427 · A Poncho Legend!

I will try to find it tonight later on if I get some time. A member in Winnipeg had the car. He is not active here any more but when he bought the car it was missing the 396, had a 350 in it. It was a very well optioned car and some members here suggested he should try the documentation. Sure enough, it came back as I recall 396, TH400, power windows, F41 and I think tilt as well as a tape player. Maybe some stuff I missed. The car was red. Some local members here may remember the guy and the car from a couple of coffee nights and chime in more when they read this.

davepl · Poncho Master!

It'd be interesting, but it's not a 69, so doesn't answer the "Why would they allow it in the Impala but not the Pontiac if they're the same chassis".

I'll shoot an email off to Jim Ewen, but that's a pretty specific piece of trivia.

4SPEED427 · A Poncho Legend!

Carl Stevenson wrote:

I will try to find it tonight later on if I get some time. A member in Winnipeg had the car. He is not active here any more but when he bought the car it was missing the 396, had a 350 in it. It was a very well optioned car and some members here suggested he should try the documentation. Sure enough, it came back as I recall 396, TH400, power windows, F41 and I think tilt as well as a tape player. Maybe some stuff I missed. The car was red. Some local members here may remember the guy and the car from a couple of coffee nights and chime in more when they read this.

Bumping this up because of a very random encounter.

This weekend at the cabin I was reading a Reader's Digest. I came across this story about Russell and his wife having heart transplants. I'm sure Russell is the guy who showed up for coffee at Robin's one night when we had a CP gathering. He was driving the red 68 2+2 and GM documented it as a 396 F41 car (along with a number of cool options). I think it was the same night we were saying goodbye to Shawn because he was moving to Edmonton.

https://www.readersdigest.ca/features/heart/heart-transplant-love-story/view-all/

Has anyone seen or heard from Russ since then? Or know the whereabouts of his car? Did he ever restore it, sell it, anyone know?

davepl · Poncho Master!

So in 1969 you could only get F41 with the 427/390... I take it that was not the case for 1968?

4SPEED427 · A Poncho Legend!

It appears that way. I know Russ did show us his documents when he got them but so far I can't find them posted here. I think he did post them
on CP though.

4SPEED427 · A Poncho Legend!

But here is the document posted way back when that contradicts the sales info. So who knows???

davepl · Poncho Master!

So wait, I thought there was a documented 396 car w/F41. A 335hp 427 seems more plausible, though still contradicts 1969 info.

4SPEED427 · A Poncho Legend!

The documented F41 396 car is a 68 though. For the life of me I can't find the thread but I'm sure some other guys recall it. It's from about 6-8 years back.

Howmac · Guru

davepl wrote:
So wait, I thought there was a documented 396 car w/F41. A 335hp 427 seems more plausible, though still contradicts 1969 info.

Not sure which web site I got this info , but it was many years ago , and I wrote it down . Apparently "1572" 1969 B body vehicles came with the F41 option. I'm assuming that is Chevrolet B body they are referring too . That build sheet Carl has shown is from a 69 Impala 427/335 that I still own but have parted . I harvested the F41 parts for one of my other projects . Thats what we do here in Manitoba...LOL

gtodrive · Guru

Not to throw a wrench into all of this, but.....my LS1 2+2 came with the F41 option.

-- Edited by gtodrive on Wednesday 8th of August 2018 12:44:09 PM

davepl · Poncho Master!

That's interesting. The sales and parts side is pretty clear in ALL its documentation that the 427/390 is required, but if that car exists, then it turns out to have been guidance and not law! How you'd sneak that one into the system I don't know, but there it is!

-- Edited by davepl on Thursday 9th of August 2018 09:30:56 AM

4SPEED427 · A Poncho Legend!

And that's actually the second one, there's this one farther up the thread.

One thing with our Canadian Pontiacs, we never say never!

Carl Stevenson wrote:

But here is the document posted way back when that contradicts the sales info. So who knows???