Enjoy 5% OFF at VEVOR Canada! and Support Canadian Poncho at the Same Time!
Members Login
Username 
 
Password 
    Remember Me  
Post Info TOPIC: Waking up a hibernating 327 small bock after a 22 year nap.


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 819
Date:
Waking up a hibernating 327 small bock after a 22 year nap.


Time to get my 67 Malibu back on the road. Been sitting since 1999. Motor is a small journal 66 327 cast nov 66. Trans is turbo 350. So we pulled the plugs, disconnected the battery and rotated it by hand. All was well till about 90% through first revolution and clunk to a dead stop. Reversed direction traveled the same 90% of a rotation and stopped at the same point. Would not move any further with a breaker bar on the crank pulley. Set distributor to tdc#1 cyl, removed distributor and intake manifold. Valley was very clean, no sludge or crud. Our theory is a stuck valve or lifter? Any thoughts or remedies? Thanks.



__________________


Canadian Poncho Superstar!

Status: Offline
Posts: 8239
Date:

pull the valve covers and give it a go lube lube

__________________

http://canadianponcho.activeboard.com/t51640378/timbuks-first-invader/ http://canadianponcho.activeboard.com/t63146560/timbuks-second-invader/  vancouver island

Nov 18 to Dec 2 Black Friday UP TO 50% OFF Plus Huge Coupons
Nov 18 to Dec 2 Black Friday UP TO 50% OFF Plus Huge Coupons


A Poncho Legend!

Status: Offline
Posts: 50128
Date:

Don't force it. Figure out which pistons are at the top when it stops, pull those plugs out and borrow a camera that you can poke in the spark plug hole. If there's something in the cylinder you could do some nice damage forcing it.

__________________

1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles 

1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars (now converted to a "factory" 4 speed)



A Poncho Legend!

Status: Offline
Posts: 50128
Date:

The engine/trans were never separated that whole time? A manual trans flywheel bolt installed in an automatic flexplate will act like that. cry   It snags on the block webbing. Going back to when I was 20 years old, ask me how I know



__________________

1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles 

1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars (now converted to a "factory" 4 speed)



Canadian Poncho Superstar!

Status: Offline
Posts: 4469
Date:

It will have a stuck valve.



__________________

Beaumontguru

MY BEAUMONT HAS 4 STUDDED TIRES AND 2 BLOCKHEATERS......AND LOTS OF OIL UNDERNEATH.  The other one has a longer roof.



Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 819
Date:

Plugs are remove. Car has been an automatic trans its entire life.  Current trans has not been removed and re installed. 



__________________


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 819
Date:

beaumontguru wrote:

It will have a stuck valve.


 Im not a mechanic but Im leaning towards a stuck valve as the culprit. Now to figure out which one it is?



-- Edited by LeeRoy on Monday 23rd of August 2021 07:12:15 PM

__________________
Nov 18 to Dec 2 Black Friday UP TO 50% OFF Plus Huge Coupons
Nov 18 to Dec 2 Black Friday UP TO 50% OFF Plus Huge Coupons


A Poncho Legend!

Status: Offline
Posts: 50128
Date:

You can figure out which 2 pistons are at the top by looking where the timing mark is when it jams.

__________________

1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles 

1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars (now converted to a "factory" 4 speed)



A Poncho Legend!

Status: Offline
Posts: 50128
Date:

Do you know how to do that or do you need a hand with it?



__________________

1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles 

1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars (now converted to a "factory" 4 speed)



Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 819
Date:

4SPEED427 wrote:

Do you know how to do that or do you need a hand with it?


 Put distributor back in, rotor should point to the cylinder thats firing when crank stops rotating? I guess thats a start?



__________________


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 661
Date:

IF IT IS A STUCK VALVE, SHOULD BE NO PROBLEM TO SEE ,

ONE OF THEM HAS TO BE LOWER THAN THE REST.

LAY A STRAIGHT EDGE ON THE TOP OF THE STEMS.

LOW ONE WILL BE QUITE VISIBLE.

ROCKER WILL BE LOOSE AS WELL!!



-- Edited by OURWAGON on Monday 23rd of August 2021 08:53:31 PM

__________________


A Poncho Legend!

Status: Offline
Posts: 50128
Date:

LeeRoy wrote:
 Put distributor back in, rotor should point to the cylinder thats firing when crank stops rotating? I guess thats a start?

 The one firing and the one across from it on the cap will both be at the top. You can do that or divide the balancer into 1/4s using the timing mark as your first mark and do it that way.



__________________

1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles 

1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars (now converted to a "factory" 4 speed)

Nov 18 to Dec 2 Black Friday UP TO 50% OFF Plus Huge Coupons
Nov 18 to Dec 2 Black Friday UP TO 50% OFF Plus Huge Coupons


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 819
Date:

OURWAGON wrote:

IF IT IS A STUCK VALVE, SHOULD BE NO PROBLEM TO SEE ,

ONE OF THEM HAS TO BE LOWER THAN THE REST.

LAY A STRAIGHT EDGE ON THE TOP OF THE STEMS.

LOW ONE WILL BE QUITE VISIBLE.

ROCKER WILL BE LOOSE AS WELL!!

Assuming the rocker arms would need to be removed to apply the straight edge to the valve stems? Looks like a good way to check unless the problem valve is stuck closed?

-- Edited by OURWAGON on Monday 23rd of August 2021 08:53:31 PM


 



__________________


Canadian Poncho Superstar!

Status: Offline
Posts: 5724
Date:

I think if the valve was stuck closed, it wouldn't be hitting a piston, which is likely what is happening? I'm GREEN here, but could you not tap on the rocker arms very carefully, just a bit of a tap, not a BFH, and you may find the stuck valve and maybe unstick it?

__________________

63 Parisienne sport coupe (The Big GTO), black, maroon interior, 409 4 speed; former owner of a 59 El Camino, 63 Corvette SWC, 62 Chev Bel Air SC.
1963- Pontiac top selling car in Canada

Mahone Bay, NS Still not old enough to need an automatic

MC


Canadian Poncho Superstar!

Status: Offline
Posts: 7675
Date:

Not an expert here, but if the valve is stuck open enough to be hitting a piston, wouldn't it be easy to see it without a straight edge?  Plus, if you were rotating the crank without a valve cover on it would be the only valve not moving to some degree, I would think.

I wouldn't think that it's one that is stuck closed as it would be stopping by pressure from the cam lobe, perhaps, and wouldn't make a clunk like a piston hitting a valve would.

Just my thoughts... hope it helps a little.



__________________


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 661
Date:

MC wrote:

Not an expert here, but if the valve is stuck open enough to be hitting a piston, wouldn't it be easy to see it without a straight edge?  Plus, if you were rotating the crank without a valve cover on it would be the only valve not moving to some degree, I would think.

I wouldn't think that it's one that is stuck closed as it would be stopping by pressure from the cam lobe, perhaps, and wouldn't make a clunk like a piston hitting a valve would.

Just my thoughts... hope it helps a little.


 MARK, I AGREE ON THE SRAIGHT EDGE IF IT IS DOWN THAT FAR, NOT HARD TO SEE.

NOT SURE HOW MUTCH GUIDANCE LEEROY NEEDS.



__________________


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 819
Date:

OURWAGON wrote:
MC wrote:

Not an expert here, but if the valve is stuck open enough to be hitting a piston, wouldn't it be easy to see it without a straight edge?  Plus, if you were rotating the crank without a valve cover on it would be the only valve not moving to some degree, I would think.

I wouldn't think that it's one that is stuck closed as it would be stopping by pressure from the cam lobe, perhaps, and wouldn't make a clunk like a piston hitting a valve would.

Just my thoughts... hope it helps a little.


 MARK, I AGREE ON THE SRAIGHT EDGE IF IT IS DOWN THAT FAR, NOT HARD TO SEE.

NOT SURE HOW MUTCH GUIDANCE LEEROY NEEDS.


 All he can get! Thanks for all the thoughts/suggestions. Grand kids visiting for a few days then back at it. Is it possible for a valve that hasnt been dropped to hit a piston in a small block? Dont think it has domed pistons.



__________________
Nov 18 to Dec 2 Black Friday UP TO 50% OFF Plus Huge Coupons
Nov 18 to Dec 2 Black Friday UP TO 50% OFF Plus Huge Coupons


Poncho Master!

Status: Offline
Posts: 1757
Date:

Yes, if an intake valve is stuck open it can hit the piston. I dont think that the exhaust valve would hit because of the smaller size. You need to pull the valve covers to see whats going on. You could also have a bit of rust at the top of one of the cylinders stopping the piston.

Paul

__________________


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 819
Date:

Valve covers and intake have been removed. You can hear the rotating assembly hitting something (clunk)when it stops moving rather than just stopping like it became stuck.



__________________


Canadian Poncho Superstar!

Status: Offline
Posts: 7773
Date:

LeeRoy wrote:

Valve covers and intake have been removed. You can hear the rotating assembly hitting something (clunk)when it stops moving rather than just stopping like it became stuck.


Is there a loose rocker arm?  If so, that may be your valve that's stuck open.



__________________
70 2+2 convertible
70 2+2 hardtop
70 Parisienne hardtop

 

 



Addicted!

Status: Offline
Posts: 177
Date:

If you manage to sort the engine I'd be at least dropping the pan on the TH350 and changing the oil and filter. My guess is you'll have a leaky TH350 though. I had to pull the TH400 out of my 1974 Premier that only has 60,000 miles on it but it had sat for a while. The seals had gone hard and weeped. Needed the converter seal, yoke seal, both speedo drive seals, O ring on the dipstick and the selector shaft seal. Got it serviced whilst it was out, was perfect other than seals and older fluid.

__________________


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 819
Date:

HK1837 wrote:

If you manage to sort the engine I'd be at least dropping the pan on the TH350 and changing the oil and filter. My guess is you'll have a leaky TH350 though. I had to pull the TH400 out of my 1974 Premier that only has 60,000 miles on it but it had sat for a while. The seals had gone hard and weeped. Needed the converter seal, yoke seal, both speedo drive seals, O ring on the dipstick and the selector shaft seal. Got it serviced whilst it was out, was perfect other than seals and older fluid.


 All good advice thank. once I confirm that the engine has survived I have a700r4 that I am going to have done over before swapping it in for the turbo 350. The 12 bolt has 3.55 gears so the overdrive feature on the 700r will help with highway cruising. Doesnt hurt that it has a much lower 1st gear for better launching.



__________________
Nov 18 to Dec 2 Black Friday UP TO 50% OFF Plus Huge Coupons
Nov 18 to Dec 2 Black Friday UP TO 50% OFF Plus Huge Coupons


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 819
Date:

So removed rocker arms and a straight edge seems to indicate that all the valves are in the closed position. Going to double check that with a better light and younger eyes.  Another suggestion is perhaps the fuel pump rod is stuck in one position after 22 year. Going to check that out next.



__________________


Uber Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 3677
Date:

LeeRoy wrote:

So removed rocker arms and a straight edge seems to indicate that all the valves are in the closed position. Going to double check that with a better light and younger eyes.  Another suggestion is perhaps the fuel pump rod is stuck in one position after 22 year. Going to check that out next.


They are closed BUT did you tap them to see if they were free and unstuck?

Did you rotate the crank and pistons with all push rods removed?



-- Edited by 67Poncho on Tuesday 7th of September 2021 03:26:59 PM

__________________

Vincent Jr.



Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 819
Date:

The rocker arms are removed, the push rods are sitting on the lifters. So if the valves are all closed there should be nothing for a piston to hit? Maybe a lifter is stuck and not riding on the cam?  Be gentle. Im an electrician not a mechanic lol.



__________________
1 2  >  Last»  | Page of 2  sorted by
 
Quick Reply

Please log in to post quick replies.

Tweet this page Post to Digg Post to Del.icio.us
.
Support Canadian Poncho!
Select Amount:
<
.
.
.