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Canadian Poncho Homepage -> Canadian Poncho -> The Lounge -> Help with a non-Poncho: 1994 Toyota Engine Control Module AND Kudos to GREASER (George)!
Post Info TOPIC: Help with a non-Poncho: 1994 Toyota Engine Control Module AND Kudos to GREASER (George)!
66 Beau


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Help with a non-Poncho: 1994 Toyota Engine Control Module AND Kudos to GREASER (George)!
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Anyone have any experience buying reman'd ECM's?

Background:

My SIL has a low mileage, 1994 Toyota Camry, 4 cyl., Auto.  Back in about September, it started acting up.  It would turn over, but wouldn't start.  It'd get towed to the dealer, and of course, it would start immediately.  Peat and Repeat over and over.  The dealer ran diagnostics to no avail and ended up changing numerous components in basically a process of elimination exercise.  No luck.  The dealership has been pretty amazing really. They have obviously got way more hours and even parts into this than they are charging for, and even supplied a courtesy car for almost a month as the mechanics tried to track the problem down.  I believe they did manage to experience the failure, but still weren't able to pinpoint the culprit.

They have finally run out of options and are offering a 'good deal on another car'.  The mechs and service mgr seem to agree that the only real option would be to replace the ECM.  No guarantee, but they feel pretty confident that the ECM is the culprit.  BUT, it's an obsolete part.

I've checked with wreckers and they've reached out through their network.  I found one in a junk yard in Williams Lake (shipping required), but it is not the exact part number.  Close, but not the same one.  It would 'probably' work, but again, no guarantee.  Given that replacing the ECM, even with the absolute correct one, is not a guarantee, installing a non-correct one is doubly risky.  If it worked, great!  If it doesn't, we won't know if it was the mismatched ECM, or if the ECM was not the problem.

Which brings me to my question:  I see RockAuto has two of these ECM's listed.  Both are 'remanufactured'.

Anyone have any experience with replacing the ECM's?  with 'remanufactured' ones?

 

Thanks in advance.

Wes 

 



-- Edited by 66 Beau on Wednesday 2nd of February 2022 02:37:02 PM

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Canadian Poncho


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Help with a non-Poncho: 1994 Toyota Engine Control Module
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I'd almost bet there's a component on the circuit board of that CCM that has a bad solder joint. Over the years with vibration and temperature change this can happen. If your handy with a soldering iron you could open it up and do a visual inspection of the solder joints. You might see something obvious. If not you could resolder some of the easier connections like resistors and transistors and give that a try. Back in the day with intermittent problems like this we'd sometimes give the ECM a good tap with a big screwdriver and if the engine stumbled you knew it was the ECM. Of course we just replaced them back then instead of repairing the bad connection.

Here's the same PCM as your car getting a faulty capacitor replaced. This could also be an issue with your ECM. Capacitors have a shelf life



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66 Beau


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Thanks Todd.

I'd be willing to bet you are correct, Or it's simply a bad connection somewhere in the wiring harness. Lots of sensors and connections that could have had a little moisture get in. There are apparently no error codes, but then as a '94, it is OBD and not OBD2, so the diagnostics are likely not as complete anyway.

Are the connections you're talking about on the board that the ECM mounts on? Or are they actually inside the grey plastic box that I think of as the actual ECM? If they are inside the grey box, I am more inclined to think that replacing the ECM might solve it...

Unfortunately, the car is at the coast, and I'm not. I've considered driving out, leaving our car for her and bringing this one home to play with. Might still go that route.

Such a shame. The car has only about 80,000 km on it and it has never been hit and was legitimately, driven by a little old lady and serviced regularly at the dealership.  Would be a great car if it would start reliably!



-- Edited by 66 Beau on Thursday 30th of December 2021 04:34:56 PM

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I'm suspecting a component on the circuit board inside the PCM. See the video I posted for an idea of what you may encounter. Of course it could be a wiring harness issue. If you could get it home and get ahold of a shop manual (you may even find one online in .pdf format for free from a forum) and start diagnosis. If you can get it to act up and determine if it's a fuel or spark issue then you could start checking all harnesses that pertain to those systems.
Also I'd check to ensure you've got good grounds. It's amazing the issues bad grounds can cause.



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DonSSDD


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A 94 was not very sophisticated, I wonder if the junkyard one would work? Probably get your money back if it didnt. I had the computer fail on my 84, it had what looked like a coffee stain on the board. Computer friend said it looked like it had gotten moisture on the surface and had arced but not fried anything. He said scrub it under hot water with a tooth brush, dry it with a hair dryer and let it sit overnight. Plugged it in, sealed the case better, it worked for several years until the car got sold. It worked fine when the car warmed up, very hard to start and keep running until it warmed up. It was a manual so you could keep it running easier in gear until it warmed up.



-- Edited by DonSSDD on Thursday 30th of December 2021 05:56:55 PM

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66 Beau


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Thanks Todd. My bad - I missed the video - my brain saw it as a banner ad.

After watching the video, I think the quickest way is to replace the module. Even if I bring it home, there is no way I'm going to be able to do a capacitor swap, which I agree is a high probability. Even with a good night's sleep, no coffee for a week and a bunch of practice, I don't know if I could I would be steady enough to unsolder/re-solder those connections.

Hopefully the 'remanufactured' unit at least has good capacitors. I hate the "replace this and see" approach, but in this case, I think it might be the best solution. If the new module doesn't resolve it, then I will arrange to bring it home to play with it. Too nice a car to be scrapped, but not worth paying shop rate to try to resolve it at this point.

I am beginning to think I should forget about learning to TIG weld. I have an old Casio guitar that is actually a synthesizer but has bad capacitors. And I know of a Suzuki Samarai that scrapped a few years ago because the ECM was bad - most likely due to bad capacitors. Learning to do fine soldering might be much more useful than TIG welding...

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66 Beau


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Don
I was posting while you were. I too suspect the junk yard one might work (I think it is for a USA built car & my SIL's was made in Japan), but the seller said he wouldn't take it back. It is quite a bit less $$ than the reman'd one, so if I had the car here, I would probably take the chance. As it is though, the actual swap, and any follow-up work would all be at shop rate, and my SIL is at wit's end already.
I'd love to pull the darn thing and have a look at the board myself, but with highway travel still severely restricted, I won't be heading back to the coast for a while (just got home from being stuck on Vancouver island for a couple weeks!).

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LOL- I had a good laugh at your "no coffee for a week". If you are like me you'd have a splitting headache from the caffeine withdrawal and wouldn't be able to do anything! As Don say perhaps one would work from another car. On GM's of that era ECM's would fit many brands but you'd swap out a PROM for your specific model. I did this when I found a bad PCM in my truck. Too bad the import ECM's weren't that way.
If you go that route at least make sure you get one from a car with the same trans (manual or auto) as the ECM may control shifting if it's an auto.


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Canadian Poncho


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There's also a few used ones on eBay:

https://www.ebay.ca/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2380057.m570.l1313&_nkw=1994+toyota+camry+ecm&_sacat=0



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Lemans64


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Never really seen ecm problems with those cars. BUT one never knows if at a dealer and they can't figure it out.
And yes the ecm does control trans so it must be from a car with same trans. Does this car have a distributor?? It's right around
the time they switched over to crank sensor trigger with two coils. If it has distilled it could be a cracked coil inside the distributor.

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On the '89 Probe we used to have, it started acting up one day.  Stalled just driving down the street - restarted and then OK.  Did a couple of other random stalls then one day it didn't start at all... turned over but didn't fire.  Started checking the fuses with a test light to see what had power and what didn't.  Touched the fuse for ignition power (I think - it was many years ago) and heard a relay click. The car then started right up.

On further examination I noticed that the steel contacts in the fuse box, the ones you push the fuse into, were cracked and losing contact.  Checked others and there were a few more that were randomly cracked as well.  Luckily, they were replaceable, so I bought a used fuse box from the junk yard and sure enough some of those were cracked as well, but there were enough good ones that I could replace all the cracked ones in the car.  Never had the problem again.

I did wonder if the car in the junkyard was sent there because of the fuse box...



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66 Beau


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The distributor & trigger sensor are items I know the dealer replaced. No joy. They also did some work on the fuel side, but Im not sure of exactly what they tried.

I have the part number (89661.33370), and I believe it is for a Made in Japan, 1994 Camry with 4 cylinder, automatic and non-California emissions. I think the one I located in Williams Lake might be the same, except Made in USA. No one can tell me they are interchangeable. Try it to see. But that means paying shop rate to R&R and flash it with the VIN. If it doesnt work, is the ECM not the problem, or was the replacement ECM not compatible?

I have a line on another scrap yard unit (through a member here). My SIL is deciding whether to try a used part, or bite the bullet & go with a remanufactured one.




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4SPEED427


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t6.jpg



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66 Beau


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Carl, is the auto wreckers database available on-line (to the public), or do you have special access?

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4SPEED427


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Oh nothing special, it's car-part.com that I used to find this.

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66 Beau


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RE: Help with a non-Poncho: 1994 Toyota Engine Control Module And KUDOS to GREASER (George)!
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Update on this thread

My SIL bought a remanufactured ECU from Rock Auto and the Toyota dealership installed it (for FREE! I have been very impressed with this dealership: Westminster
Toyota). And after about a month of flawless starts, it seems to be resolved. With the remanufactured ECU, the car has started every time without problem.

I want to send a big thank you to all those who responded. And an Especially big Thank You and Kudos to Greaser (George). He PM'd me, offered to pull an ECU from a car he found at pick n pull in Calgary (along with any other pieces we might want). He went to the car, pulled it apart enough to read the part number, and unfortunately, it was not a match. But, I am so very thankful for George. Taking the time doing this for someone he's never met is above and beyond. He's truly one in a million.

Thank you George. If I can return the favour, please let me know.

Wes



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George is a good egg.


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timbuk


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nice work george! nobody would want to trash a toyota with 80k from that era!

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Greaser


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66 Beau wrote:

Update on this thread

My SIL bought a remanufactured ECU from Rock Auto and the Toyota dealership installed it (for FREE! I have been very impressed with this dealership: Westminster
Toyota). And after about a month of flawless starts, it seems to be resolved. With the remanufactured ECU, the car has started every time without problem.

I want to send a big thank you to all those who responded. And an Especially big Thank You and Kudos to Greaser (George). He PM'd me, offered to pull an ECU from a car he found at pick n pull in Calgary (along with any other pieces we might want). He went to the car, pulled it apart enough to read the part number, and unfortunately, it was not a match. But, I am so very thankful for George. Taking the time doing this for someone he's never met is above and beyond. He's truly one in a million.

Thank you George. If I can return the favour, please let me know.

Wes

 Wes, I was more than happy to help in whatever way I could.

Too bad that particular 94 Toyota at PnP didn't have a matching ECU, it could have saved a few dollars.

I'm glad the remanufactured  ECU worked and your SIL can use the car again. She needed a positive in her life.

Like Tim says nobody wants to trash a low mileage car when there is still lots of driving left in the car.

Glad in trying to help Wes, just playing it forward would repay the favour.

-G



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