Having sat in a new one just the other day and the older Challenger the week before I am looking forward to seeing the new Camaro in the flesh. They seem to be hyping the heck out of the Camaro. Will they get off their a**es and release it already.

Is it just me or does the new Camaro and Challenger look alike?

Maybe it's me, but the Challenger looks the best of the three in my opinion

Why is the hold up?

I have seen them in the flesh but at shows not a showroom. I very much like the Challenger. They have a special edition coming out in the Spring in B5 blue that I really, really want.

Hillar, Pass along some links to your other forums about this?

It seems all three are big and bulky. Even the Mustang seems larger than the 68-9

65Camino wrote:

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Why is the hold up?

I have seen them in the flesh but at shows not a showroom. I very much like the Challenger. They have a special edition coming out in the Spring in B5 blue that I really, really want.

Hillar, Pass along some links to your other forums about this?

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As we saw at Woodward Darryl, Mopar is way ahead on the curve on getting the Challenger out and more options on how to order it.  I happen to think there is quite a limited market for these type of cars and once that demand is satisfied, that is going to be it.  If you are going to be late to the party like GM is, you may miss it all together.  All the signs for the US economy are not looking good at this point and may be quite brutal by next Feb. when the Camaro is actually scheduled to be available.  I don't want to frighten anyone but I just got back from an energy seminar and if we have a normal winter, it looks like we may hit $1.50 a litre as there is a serious refining and storage shortage now that won't manifest itself until the high demand winter months. 

The Camaro may be the superior product, but no one may be able/want to buy it then and therefore it will look like a giant failure, GM grossly misjudged the market once again, etc.  There really is no excuse for how long it is taking GM to get this car out to the market.  It should be out right now to generate showroom traffic so the average consumer who won't even consider anything other than an Accord/Camry might actually look at a new Malibu.  They say they want to "get it right", well other manufacturers seem to be able to "get it right" in 1/2 the time GM needs.

Here is one of my rants from another forum:

Opinions on the car's styling and interior remain mixed. Even if it is a mechanical tour de force, there is absolutely no question that GM took far too long to make the decision to re-enter the market, and then far too long to engineer and produce the vehicle. As many of us have noted, this lethargy will probably cause GM to miss most of this market all together.
This is no more than criminal mismanagement, and this is just more evidence that a lot of GM management heads should roll.

Have a look at these Rants by Peter M. De Lorenzo of Autoextremist.com, I could not have said it better myself:

http://www.autoextremist.com/current/?currentPage=7

http://www.autoextremist.com/current/

Time to chop chop:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20080708.IBGM08/TPStory/TPBusiness/

http://daveibsen.typepad.com/5_blogs_before_lunch/2008/07/general-motors-re-considers-its-brand-product-strategy.html

Carl Stevenson wrote:

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69Laurentian wrote:

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It seems all three are big and bulky. Even the Mustang seems larger than the 68-9

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Agreed. What ever happened to sleek??? My least favorite Challenger shot is a dead on nose look at it. Way too big...

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Guys, you have to remember that this a completely different environment from a legislative perspective than the late 60's.  At that time emission controls were in their infancy and the only safety mandated items that cars had to have were seat belts and side door guard beams.

Today the list of requirements the manufacturers have to meet is almost endless.  Airbags and safety restraint systems galore, severe crash testing from every angle, plus the added weight of all the computer systems, monitors and sensors to run everything, the legacy of those first emission controls.  Quite frankly it is amazing the horsepower that can now be produced by engines that run very clean and get terrific fuel economy.  And then there are all the creature comforts that people demand today that were luxuries in the 60's - A/C, PW, power seats, mega sound systems, etc., they all add weight and size.  I think all three look pretty good considering what the manufacturers have to put up with!

On Friday at Coney Island on Woodward,before they would let you on the lot I was looking at the Red RS Camaro.I asked a guy in a GM Security shirt what was under the hood of the RS version? His answer,I'm not really Sure! Thats GMs problem!! What the Hell?

It will only get worse when Lutz retires.

Sorry, I just can't get real hot about the Mustang either. I wish they would have made a Firebird like those drawings that someone did that were floating around online last winter. It looked better than the Camaro. I guess I'm just too old school.

And Todd, I suspect you are right. I think Mr Lutz was a good shot in the arm but a bit late.

Well not to hijack the thread, but this G8 GT showed up out front of Stoneleigh Pontiac Buick Cadillac in Midland when I was at the cottage. The sticker said $41,000, a bit more than most 2009 Cadillac CTS's he had. It was sold in a week.

When I first saw it from the side I thought it was a Camry!

-- Edited by 73SC at 00:08, 2008-08-27