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Canadian Poncho Homepage -> Canadian Poncho -> 1970 + Canadian Pontiac General Forum -> Found a 70 Orbit Orange GTO...expert help please?
Post Info TOPIC: Found a 70 Orbit Orange GTO...expert help please?
JacksGTO


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Found a 70 Orbit Orange GTO...expert help please?
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Hello, I was hoping for some help with a potential purchase of this 242 vin car. I saw the car in person and the 10 year Orbit orange looks pretty close to correct. Car is straight with some plastic here and there. New interior that's actually very nice and correct, buckets console A/C hood tach and rear wing. Cowl Tag says Made in Canada and there are lots of numbers on it. I made out the 60 for orbit orange but was wondering if there a list somewhere for the canadian built cars. Have to check for that Judge W code. Does PHS have Canadian car docs or do I have to contact GM of Canada? NOM 400, T400 and a 12 bolt rear. Is it true only 455 cars came with 12 bolt? Details are sketchy. I didn't get numbers off of it yet. Is the housing different than the Chevy 12 bolt, like an hourglass shape? Are 455 cars worth more even if original engine is gone? It's a running car that needs lots of detail work under hood and chassis and some trim items. Wondering if it's a worthwhile project in this bad economy. Would make a nice Judge clone.I Can grab it for around $13K.

Went back again today to get some numbers. Here's the cowl tag.

70 24237 OS592010 BDY
TR 258 102B PNT
8D D55C50C60C??
U80 M40

From what I understand its a black bucket interior(258) with console(D55)which it is.
C50 rear defog, C60 AC, U80 rear spkr, M40 TurboHydro.
I guess only the Canadian cars list some RPO's on the tags. I am stumped on the absense of the paint code. I thought the 60 under the PNT letters was the 60 for orbit orange, but it seems that is for the next line of RPO's and the C60 RPO falls right under it. Anyone know if this was a common thing for paint codes being left blank? I know I have to get the PHS, I hope they have the Canadian car info. Wondering how much a color change hurts the value, if it is a color change. But the car is so nice I think I'm gonna pull the trigger anyway. If the price is gets a lot closer to $10K that forgives a lot of short comings. Any opinions?????????

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70GTO.jpg


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4SPEED427


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I know you need expert help, and that I am not. However, a couple of thoughts.

I would get the GM Canada documents. Not sure if I would even try the PHS. Since you know it's Canadian, the Canada stuff will be fine.

I believe that is correct, 12 bolts for 455 only. It is identical to a Chevelle 12 bolt.

And my opinion is that even if the original 455 is gone, if it's a 455 car it is worth more.

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73SC


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Is it possible the PNT code is 10 28 which would be white lowerr with blue top?

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65beau


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I like the Cragers, neat

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JacksGTO


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http://www.gtoalley.com/seventy.html

I think that's the location for the build date. 102B doesn't make sense though. Does anyone know how the VIN relates to build date? 10 is for October and it's a very low vin so maybe it is an early car.

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65sssd


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If the body is done and the paint is nice, I would make him a offer. A running driving gto with a 12 bolt in it for anywhere around the 10K is about right. My concern would be the body. A car with poor undercarrage and trim is a bondo and paint car.

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pontorquer


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 Hi Jack,

  Alot of cars built in Oshawa came with the famous chevy 12 bolt including mine which is a 1972 Pontiac Lemans 400, we were fortunate in Canada, all sorts of GM cars came with the 12 bolt, I`ve seen 69 Beaumont 307 with 12 bolts, 68 Olds Cutlass 350...In the states, only 1970 and up Pontiac GTO, Lemans, GP ...with 455`s came with the chevy 12 bolt. I hope you buy this beautiful 1970 GTO !

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455gto


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PHS would have doc's on this car .... if it was shipped to a US dealer. GM of Canada will have it if it was shipped to a Canadian dealer. Try the PHS first and if they don't have it....they direct you to GM of Canada.
If you like the colour of the car it dosen't matter inless you want to flip the car. Check that the Vin and cowl tag hasn't been tampered with. Check for rust on the frame, front lower fenders,rear 1/4s and trunk. Check the 2 letter code on the front of the block just below the passenger head to see what is in there now.
I noticed the lack of rocker, window and drip rail chrome. Also the parking light fillers.
If you can afford it and get it for $10,000. You can't go wrong with a 455 car.

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Astro Jet


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I would try and get the PHS first, only because they give you more info and the last time I looked, it was cheaper than GM of Canada documentation.  If it was originally a 455 car, it will have a 12 bolt as standard.  If it was built in Canada, it is possible it could have come with a 12 bolt even if it had a 400.  BTW Chevy 12 bolt = GM 12 bolt as used in Pontiacs.  Olds had their own 12 bolt, but it is completely different.  Just check the VIN, if the plant code is 1, it is an Oshawa built car.

If you are planning to flip it, I would definitely keep it the original colour, but if you are planning to keep it long term, do with it as you like, including adding options that it did not originally come with.  If you are really worried about the originality of the colour, pull off one of the door sill mouldings and look underneath, most people won't bother to prep this area properly and remove all traces of the previous colour.

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pontorquer


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 I have also seen late 60`s Olds Cutlass with Chevy 12 bolts as well as the Olds 12 bolts rearend.

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68sd


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just if you need it


24237--GTO 2 door hatdtop

OSHAWA built

258 --black interior

10 2B--polar white paint ,with black vinyl top

8D--4th week of august 1969 production date

D55 -console
c50-rear defogger
c60-air conditioning
u80-auxilary rear speaker
m40-turbo 400 trans


32 731 made in the us of thet body style

-- Edited by 68sd at 09:49, 2008-12-30

-- Edited by 68sd at 16:53, 2008-12-30

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68sd


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JacksGTO


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That's interesting. Is the 2 in the 2B top code unique to Canadian cars? I would expect to see 10 B for that combo, not 10 2B. Thanks for the feedback.

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JacksGTO


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That's interesting. Is the 2 in the 2B top code unique to Canadian cars? I would expect to see 10 B for that combo, not 10 2B. Thanks for the feedback.

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68sd


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i thought in 69 /70,1 was convert top and 2 was vinyl top and then the colour A white, B black?
  and yes August is a very early car!!
-- Edited by 68sd at 16:50, 2008-12-30

-- Edited by 68sd at 16:51, 2008-12-30

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68sd


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my 69 beau is a factory 307 12 bolt car,it has the F40 suspension package

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JacksGTO


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Well guys, the verdict is in...My dreams of a 455 bargain GTO are shattered... GM Canada came through with the info and you guys were very helpful in keeping me in line. It turns out it is a regular 400/350hp GTO, no wing, no hood tach, Polar white with a black top. Turns out the cowl tag is pretty accurate in showing important options and as Pontorquer pointed out 12 bolts could show up anywhere. Nice car for the money I suppose, but I'm passin' on it. Thanks for the help guys.

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4SPEED427


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JacksGTO wrote:

Well guys, the verdict is in...My dreams of a 455 bargain GTO are shattered... GM Canada came through with the info and you guys were very helpful in keeping me in line. It turns out it is a regular 400/350hp GTO, no wing, no hood tach, Polar white with a black top. Turns out the cowl tag is pretty accurate in showing important options and as Pontorquer pointed out 12 bolts could show up anywhere. Nice car for the money I suppose, but I'm passin' on it. Thanks for the help guys.


Too bad but at least GM Canada paid off for you. It's a great resource. I sure hope they never give it up.

 



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455Lemans


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'72 and up GM cowl tags show engine indentification codes. Gotta watch out for the clones!

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455Lemans wrote:

'72 and up GM cowl tags show engine indentification codes. Gotta watch out for the clones!


I expect what you meant to say was that '72 and up Vins include an engine identification digit, not the Cowl Tags..


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Hey there, There is a decoding book available for 64-74 gto available as I restored a 69 back to origional with it. Lent it to a friend, never got it back.(some friend!) I found it in a speed shop in surrey b.c. Ask around at local shops they had them for all kinds of makes/models. 25$ I think, I will try to track mine down in the meantime.

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the70judge


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JacksGTO wrote:

Well guys, the verdict is in...My dreams of a 455 bargain GTO are shattered... GM Canada came through with the info and you guys were very helpful in keeping me in line. It turns out it is a regular 400/350hp GTO, no wing, no hood tach, Polar white with a black top. Turns out the cowl tag is pretty accurate in showing important options and as Pontorquer pointed out 12 bolts could show up anywhere. Nice car for the money I suppose, but I'm passin' on it. Thanks for the help guys.

I did not see the vin on this one but in the vin would of been a number one showing it was a Oshawa GTO  and If it was a Judge it would of had the WT! on the cowl tag... All of the Canadian Judges had it on the cowl tag and they also had 10 bolts in them.. The only GTO with a 12 bolt would of been a 455... I have been told that all the Canadian Judges were Ram Air III cars... no exceptions.....

 



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eeluddy


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I want Warren Oates 455 GTO from Two Lane Blacktop...........

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the70judge


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eeluddy wrote:

I want Warren Oates 455 GTO from Two Lane Blacktop...........


Good luck... be nice to have one of them...  http://ultimategto.com/cgi-bin/showcar.cgi?type=search&line=1285822443&pic=/1970/70_00046_1

Here is a shot of one of the camera ones.. What is left of it...

 



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Pete
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The last I heard the Two Lane Blacktop GTO was in Alaska. It was frame off restored back to showroom and not like the movie car (no more Keystone wheels etc)


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