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Canadian Poncho Homepage -> Canadian Poncho -> General Pre 1958 Canadian Pontiac Discussions -> 239 Won't start...
Post Info TOPIC: 239 Won't start...
bob53


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239 Won't start...
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The weather being so nice I went to start the 53  It wouldn't fire
There is spark at the plugs and it's getting fuel
I had it running about a month ago with no issues
As it sits right now I know it's badly flooded, I've pulled the plugs and cleaned them
I pulled the carb and found about an inch of gas sitting in the intake
I sucked it out and put every thing back together but still no go

Any Ideas?

Bob

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4SPEED427


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Often if plugs are fouled bad, they have to be replaced. They just won't fire no matter how much you clean them.

The only way I've seen them resurrected from severe fouling is one of those old spark plug cleaners (sandblaster) which nobody has any more.

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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles 

1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars (now converted to a "factory" 4 speed)
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bob53


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I did try a set, not new but from a running 239
I'm thinking there is still gas that I can't get out of the engine
I will try a new set of plugs just have to find them
Thanks, Carl

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Fitz


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At worst, try to let your fouled sparkplug being heated one night by your house heating system.

Also start for a while your engine without the sparkplug, you should this way dry most of the gas inside.

Fitz.

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bob53


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Thats what I'll do but I will pick up some new plugs first
Thanks Fitz

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Pontiacanada


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Bob, if you just putt around occasionally you might need a hotter plug.
My '64 283 takes a Delco R-43, R-44, or R-45. My engine gave up starting, it's plugs are carbed-up/fouled (it has R-43s in it, for "faster" driving habits), I'm switching to a hotter R-45.

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'64 Parisienne CS "barn find" - last on the road in '86 ... Owner Protection Plan booklet, original paint, original near-mint aqua interior, original aqua GM floor mats, original 283, factory posi, and original rust.

bob53


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I put about 2000 miles on last summer and I don't think I drive like an old lady
I think I'll stick with the original plugs for now but thanks for the suggestion

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bob53


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Well I tried the new plugs today still nothing
I have points, condenser, cap and rotor on order
But I'm wondering if it might be something with the carb, stuck float maybe?

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Rolilk


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Hard to say. This past summer I had some trouble with my WCD. the acellerator pump just was not working. I had to hold the pedal to the floor while turning it over before it would fire and had to hold the gas till it ran smoothly.I'm in the middle af a carb rebuild. Did you notice if she turned over slowly? maybe give your battery a charge and see if its cause she is turning over too slow? Does it try to fire at all or nothing at all? When mine is being hard, I held the accelelator most of the way down and only then would she fire up. If she ran well only a month ago I don't see it being a stuck float, but I've been wrong before..

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bob53


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I do have the battery fully charged when I go to start it and it doesn't even try to fire
In the summer two pumps at a cold start and it will fire right up and hot start I don't
even touch the gas or forget it


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Fitz


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Just for the fun of it, sand with a high grade sandpaper your points(breaker). It maybe don't fire due to the compression, because of a low voltage at the sparkplug.

Without compression it can fire.

Also, look for the wire going out of your distributor, it must be isolate from the distributor housing.

If it's fire up, replace the points quickly because sanded point don't last long.

Fitz.



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dualquadpete


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Have you checked to see or DID YOU, put any fuel stabilizer in the tank?? Ig the gas [if you can call the crap we get now this] has gone bad it won't fire that stuff. have you tried giving the carb a "dribble" of fresh gas??? Just a thought,the gas only is good for a week or 2 b-4 it goes 'fousty"

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bob53


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Ok, new points condenser coil cap and rotor
Gas does have stabilizer and I did try some down the carb earlier
Checked wire through distributor... seems fine
I do have gas in the intake again so I'm thinking disconnect the fuel line before the
pump, pop the carb and clean up the gas then try to fire by spraying starter fluid directly
into the intake
Any thoughts?



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Taylor55


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Pull the dipstick and check the oil for gas. If the oil is saturated with gas the engine cannot build compression to fire. If it is saturated that is one problem the next is to find out why it flooded, stuck float, faulty accelerator pump?

Al

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bob53


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There doesn't seem to be any gas in the oil, even had the wife give it a sniff to be sure
I did pull the plugs again and they don't seem to be fouled

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tin indian


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it is possible to wash down the cylinder walls when flooding an engine that bad. this would result in loss of compression, which can give you a no start(like taylor said) disconnect or stop fuel flow to the engine, remove spark plugs, and turn it over to build up oil pressure. install your plugs, give it some fuel, and try to fire it up.

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bob53


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If I did like you said but without the carb on and sprayed starter fluid in the intake... it should fire right? And if it did fire my problem is with the carb dumping too much fuel
Does that sound right?
I have also heard of putting a tablespoon of oil in each cylinder when badly flooded

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tin indian


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i doubt it would start without the carb, as the air fuel mixture would be way out to lunch, but you never know. but the tablespoon of oil is on the right track.

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66 parisienne, 427
bob53


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I'm not really looking for it to start... just something to show the plugs will fire

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tin indian


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if the spark is blue, they will ignite atomized fuel.

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66 parisienne, 427
Fitz


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What I use the most of the time to knowing if sparkplug fire inside the cylinder is the timing light. The sparkplug can spark outside the cylinder but not screw into the head if a ignition problem occur.

Try all the wire including the coil to the distributor one. Look at the light, a regular slow flashing on sparkplug wire is OK and a quick flashing on the coil wire is OK. If you see nothing, your ignition is the problem.  After you can move to the admission (carb) to look the problem for.

Good luck.

Fitz.

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bob53


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Thanks Fitz, I will try that for my own peace of mind
Upon further investigation of the carb I found rusty deposits partially clogging
the internal fuel filter,and I'm sure some got into the carb
Time for a rebuild, wish me luck

Bob

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1954 Ken


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I should have my rebuilt carb back tomorrow.  Ill drop it off at your place after work.  Let me know if it works out.

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bob53


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Hey Ken did Keith get an extra accelerator pump when he got the stuff for you?

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bob53


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Thanks for the loan of your carb Ken, works great... too bad that's not my problem
OK here's what I see...
Good spark at the plugs
Fuel getting from the carb to the intake manifold...
Where it pools
No gas getting to the cylinders
When I pulled the plugs again the little bit of oil was still there and no sign of fuel
Anyone have any ideas, I'm pulling out my hair here

Bob

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