I wish I would have grabbed a few more things off the 70 Safari Estate wagon I kind of parted out in 2009. The engine ended up in my Parisienne as an LS6, but I wish I could have harvested the disc brakes and the rear pan-hard bar. As you can see in the engine photo, it included the mid-year change to throttle cable instead of linkage.
I was hoping it was a posi diff, but wasn't that lucky. Hillar grabbed the rear wind deflector, it made it's way to Toronto in the trunk of the green/gold 70 2+2 he bought from me. It was a fairly plain car, it may have had the maplight under the rear view mirror, I can't remember. I can't remember if it had the 3rd seat, but there was a large footwell just inside the rear cargo door. Hillar would have known, as he was routing around back there for a while removing the rear speaker. I've got the VIN here somewhere.
-- Edited by seventy2plus2 on Friday 14th of October 2016 05:49:33 PM
AND? Why didn't you? Goodness, that one is rusty! Did you save the data tag? 3-seater? Options?
Unfortunately I was working on it at a friends place, and I only had a couple weeks to work on it as he wanted it out of there. His place is outside the city, and finding someone to come get the car for salvage was a challenge. As it turned out, when the salvage guy picked it up he said he could have dragged it so I could have grabbed the discs. I never even thought of the pan-hard bar, but recently learned the station wagon ones have a smaller bushing on the differential end. And talk about rusty, the frame rails were non-existent.
-- Edited by seventy2plus2 on Friday 14th of October 2016 07:14:49 PM
However, I've seen other ratios, as Big John Preikschat's 70 454 2+2 hardtop by Regina has 2.21 gears. He's idling at 60 mph.
Clint, I had to recheck the axle ratios after you above comment clicked in... I re-checked the chart, and I do not see a 2:21 listed... are you sure?
I seem to remember seeing the 2.21's listed in the Chevy Impala documentation that's provided by Oshawa with our build sheets. I don't know if you've ever met Big John, but he's the size of a mountain, and if he says he's got 2.21's I'm not going to argue with him. His is a fully loaded car with automatic a/c and the cloth interior. I don't think he drives it much anymore, it's in need of a restoration.
IMHO carbed motors don't like RPM's much below 1700 for cruising over long periods. I think that's why your 454 was working better when you hit the light traffic and the 110KPH speed limit in NB and kept it at 80. It was running nice and hot and cooked all the bad junk off your valves, carb, and intake. I had a 75 350 Nova, moved to St John's when it was 3 years old, never went beyond the overpass much, it really didn't work as good as it did when I lived in PEI and did a lot of highway driving all the time.
My mother in law grew up in Bay Roberts, there is a picture in the Bartlett museum in Brigus of Captain Bartlett landing in Brigus with a baby polar bear on the deck of his ship, it would have been around 1920's? My mother in law was there and saw the polar bear when she was a kid. Brigus is a photogenic place, you see it all the time on the Newfoundland Targa race, all those white picket fences with cars going by them and through them.
Did you stop at Lick A Chick for a chicken dinner?
Don
__________________
63 Parisienne sport coupe (The Big GTO), black, maroon interior, 409 4 speed; former owner of a 59 El Camino, 63 Corvette SWC, 62 Chev Bel Air SC. 1963- Pontiac top selling car in Canada
Mahone Bay, NS Still not old enough to need an automatic
I wish I had looked a little harder at this one at the time!
Can't remember if saw these or not... But, in any event.... YOUR KILLING ME HERE! (Cheviac too I am sure) I was trying to read the fender flashes.. isn't a 454, is it? Did she disappear?
IMHO carbed motors don't like RPM's much below 1700 for cruising over long periods. I think that's why your 454 was working better when you hit the light traffic and the 110KPH speed limit in NB and kept it at 80. It was running nice and hot and cooked all the bad junk off your valves, carb, and intake. I had a 75 350 Nova, moved to St John's when it was 3 years old, never went beyond the overpass much, it really didn't work as good as it did when I lived in PEI and did a lot of highway driving all the time.
My mother in law grew up in Bay Roberts, there is a picture in the Bartlett museum in Brigus of Captain Bartlett landing in Brigus with a baby polar bear on the deck of his ship, it would have been around 1920's? My mother in law was there and saw the polar bear when she was a kid. Brigus is a photogenic place, you see it all the time on the Newfoundland Targa race, all those white picket fences with cars going by them and through them.
Did you stop at Lick A Chick for a chicken dinner?
Don
As long as it was a decent level highway with little to no wind against her bow, she is fine! But I agree with you, 1500 or above, you could hear the difference if she had to work.... 1800-ish and she found her sweet spot... that is why I am tossing around the idea for the 3:07's... My '70 coupe with the efi'ed 454 and 5-gear runs @1800 at 70....
That being said, if her engine was freshened up, she probably wouldn't mind! I also agree with cleaning up the valves... It could have been me but she sure felt better...either that or I got better than 92 octane at the last fill up! (lol)
You will love the next batch of photos as they are of Brigus and surrounding towns... ALSO, Targa was filming through Brigus and I specifically placed the wagon so that every onboard camera would record it as they went by! The next time they air the program, the wagon will be in the shot! That too is another story that I will air at a later date!
-- Edited by 67Poncho on Saturday 15th of October 2016 08:48:47 AM
I'm curious why you chose to put the overdrive tranny in your wagon when it already had very highway friendly gears? I would think the stock 2,000 odd rpm at 60 MPH is already on the low end of ideal.
I always liked the feel of a car that runs in the mid two's at 60, say 3.08 or so. A compromise that allows quiet cruising but also keeping the engine deep enough into the power band that power is effortless and highway hills don't cause downshifts or lugging.
This was the Peace River yard in 2007, and I think it was crushed out in about 2010. The whole yard! It was a 350 car. There was also a 70 2+2 there.
67Poncho wrote:.
StriperSS wrote:
I wish I had looked a little harder at this one at the time!
Can't remember if saw these or not... But, in any event.... YOUR KILLING ME HERE! (Cheviac too I am sure) I was trying to read the fender flashes.. isn't a 454, is it? Did she disappear?
I toured that yard in the late nineties and it had some awesome stuff at the time. Then it changed hands and when I went to take a look a the stuff again about 7 or eight years ago the new owner said he was sick of guys that looked and didn't buy. I did reply that it was pretty hard to commit to buying anything in a boneyard without looking at it, at which point he basically told me to F off, so I did.
I guess from his point of view just crushing them was better than selling parts or cars. Unfortunately Aldon auto parts in Lamont where there was a huge yard with many old Ponchos now has the same policy where they won't let you into the yard so I guess you have to have ESP to find a part.
I never enjoyed dealing with those guys in any case and that kind of put an end to it for me. I guess crushing will follow or already has.
For finding out how it would run with different rear gears, try smaller tires for testing purposes. I have 3.08's and a 4 speed, no speedo cable yet (next week it will be here) but my tach says 2500 at about 115KPH (an educated guess) with 28.5 rear tires. Yours are probably 26-27 inches? I'd aim for about 1800 for a 70 MPH cruise RPM minimum, especially if you are running it below 70 MPH a high percentage of the time and run only premium. Premium around here has no ethanol, your old carb won't like ethanol.
Targa- I'll keep an eye out for the Poncho celebrity when the show airs for 2016.
Don
__________________
63 Parisienne sport coupe (The Big GTO), black, maroon interior, 409 4 speed; former owner of a 59 El Camino, 63 Corvette SWC, 62 Chev Bel Air SC. 1963- Pontiac top selling car in Canada
Mahone Bay, NS Still not old enough to need an automatic
'64 Parisienne CS "barn find" - last on the road in '86 ... Owner Protection Plan booklet, original paint, original near-mint aqua interior, original aqua GM floor mats, original 283, factory posi, and original rust.
I'm curious why you chose to put the overdrive tranny in your wagon when it already had very highway friendly gears? I would think the stock 2,000 odd rpm at 60 MPH is already on the low end of ideal.
Well, 60 for me especially on the Prairies is a tad, dare I say, grandpa-ish! (I use that term with the greatest respect) I like doing the 70-75mph range, just below the Kojak Kodak if at all possible! At 70 with the THM400, she was up to @2300rpm. So, at 80mph, she was turning almost 2500rpm... No need for that... Just personal preference...
I toured that yard in the late nineties and it had some awesome stuff at the time. Then it changed hands and when I went to take a look a the stuff again about 7 or eight years ago the new owner said he was sick of guys that looked and didn't buy. I did reply that it was pretty hard to commit to buying anything in a boneyard without looking at it, at which point he basically told me to F off, so I did.
I guess from his point of view just crushing them was better than selling parts or cars. Unfortunately Aldon auto parts in Lamont where there was a huge yard with many old Ponchos now has the same policy where they won't let you into the yard so I guess you have to have ESP to find a part.
I never enjoyed dealing with those guys in any case and that kind of put an end to it for me. I guess crushing will follow or already has.
Since we have patrons with popcorn waiting in hand, shall we continue.......
As I was saying previously, it is quite humbling the attention the wagon got whether it was from just plain curiosity, general interest, or resurrecting a bygone family memory! Lets face it... she looks like me! Not the best looking chap in the world, tired, worn and missing much of her paint like I am my hair! And least appealing of all, turning near 50! (lolol)
While waiting to board, an older gentleman walked up to me from the car behind and started chatting... interested in the car.... The first and most for-most question I got asked, "when are you going to paint it" in an English accent... Looking back, I should have got a business card of some sort made up to explain the cars history and why, with pros and cons, it has or most certainly be left alone, as much as possible! Turns out, I will become friends with him and his step brother along the voyage and while visiting Newfoundland...
As the warning announcement came over the loud speaker, we were ready to start loading.... Jump in the car and wait our turn..... Due to the eastward climate, again remember, these cars, especially simple transportation vehicles like the Estate disappeared 10 years after they rolled off the line... unless someone kept better care of them... So, you can imagine the looks she got, and possibly me, from those that had not seen a wagon of this era, the way she looked, for nearly 40 years.... I felt like the Queen of England... my hand was sore and my cheeks hurt... (not really, I rather liked the attention)
On the boat we go, park where instructed and go top side! Since all the berths were booked, didn't matter to me because that was another $200 on top of the $347 passage the Estate and I required for passage. These boats have what we call daynighters as well for those that wish not to fork out the extra money for a berth.... or when making shorter crossings. Basically, for most intents and purposes, what can be, a somewhat uncomfortable recliner....
From the port of North Sydney, there are 2 routes to the Island... one, 5-7hr run that will go to west coast port of Port Aux Basques and the summer run only, 15-17hr run that will go to the east coast to the port of Argentia... Since I live just an hour outside of St. John's, the east run is the voyage of choice.... If I had missed the Argentia run and been forced to take the Port Aux Basques run, there would have been another 9-10 hour drive across the Island to get to my hometown... and depending on when we docked, another overnight stay! Another plus side of the east coast Argentia run, the time to relax, wind down and recharge from my 3 1/2 day 2700mi sprint across Canada.... something the west ferry and Island drive wouldn't provide! I will supply pics for all to explain!
So, on the way topside, met up again with the English gent and his brother and found out we were headed in the same direction... to the daynighters or airseats as they were now called! Since the airseats were a pair of 2 per row, I managed to get a good window view with both brothers one each behind the other.... It was a sparse population in there so there was lots of room. Throw down my personal affects and time to roam... just as I did as a kid when I went on the boats with my Dad! Only downside, I was no longer free to roam the most important areas of the ship... the engine room and wheelhouse! I walked through the ship to familiarize myself as I knew this would be the one I would take on my return trip..
Start main engines, engage the prop, bow and stern thrusters to keep her firmly against the dock and release the lines.... reverse the bow and stern thrusters to push away from the dock and slowly reverse! We were on our way... Now, just to kick back, relax, converse with my newfound, Newfoundland bound friends and travel mates and enjoy the voyage.....
-- Edited by 67Poncho on Sunday 16th of October 2016 11:29:15 AM
Brings back some memories for me. I rode the Port Aux Basques Ferry in fall 1988 When I drove my 1939 Buick to Newfoundland to visit a friend. That route worked well for me as he lived in Corner brook. I still remember the greeting I got from the guys at the first gas station I stopped at on the island with that car. I was almost mobbed. Most of the guys thought I was a Newfy that had made it big in Alberta (with the plates) but as soon as I opened my mouth they knew I wasn't. Still friendly bunch though.
I'm gonna have to go back and finish that run one of these days as Corner brook was as far as I got. I had three weeks off at the time and it took me a week and a bit to get there so I figured I'd better turn around. Kind of a dumb move.
Sure appreciate the story Vince as I can really empathize with how it feels to drive a 50 year old car across the country. Kind of keeps you alert all day, thats for sure.
As mentioned before I'm thoroughly enjoying each stage of the trip. Going back to when I was giving you a hard time about worrying as you make your trip with an old car I've thought a little more about it. Ken has also referred to it but a couple things come to mind. One being it has been awhile since you've done a road trip and I think you'll find the more trips you do the less you'll worry about it. You obviously can quickly gain confidence with these cars because they are very simple by today's standards. I'd be interested to hear Clint's opinion on this too as he does some long runs. Other thing is I'm a little older than you at 62 but in all my years of driving and I've put on quite a few miles, I can only think of 3 times when one of my vehicles has left me stranded on the road. 2 of them were late model Chevys with the new style fuel pumps in the tank. Anyhow keep it coming and thanks for all the details.
Have been enjoying the read as much as all the others. Thought I would do up the mileage for the trip so far, since you made mention of it a while back.
Started at 5426 on the odometer.
5669- 243 mi- 51L = 18mpg
5952- 283 mi- 62.49L =17.14mpg
6186 - 234 mi - 45.4L = 19.51 mpg
6251 - 65 mi - 15.3L = 16.08 mpg
6496 - 245 mi- 47.51L = 19.52 mpg
6708 - 212 mi - 44.27L = 18.13 mpg
6874 - 166 mi - 36.54L = 17.2 mpg
6954 - 80 mi - 21.3L = 14.24 mpg
7156 - 202 mi - 44L = 17.38 mpg
7378 - 222 mi - 43L = 19.54 mpg
7609 - 231 mi - 48L = 18.27 mpg
7795 - 189 mi- 45L = 15.6 mpg
8087 - 289 mi - 63.5L = 17.23 mpg
These are the mileages that are in the post at each full up. The average for the trip to this point is 17.52 mpg. This seems to me to pretty damn good for a 50 year old vehicle and 454 ci engine with a 4 bbl carb. i'm sure that the 700r4 would be helping out. Don't think it would be that good with the old 400.
Looking forward to the next installment of your trip Vince.
Brings back some memories for me. I rode the Port Aux Basques Ferry in fall 1988 When I drove my 1939 Buick to Newfoundland to visit a friend. That route worked well for me as he lived in Corner brook. I still remember the greeting I got from the guys at the first gas station I stopped at on the island with that car. I was almost mobbed. Most of the guys thought I was a Newfy that had made it big in Alberta (with the plates) but as soon as I opened my mouth they knew I wasn't. Still friendly bunch though.
I'm gonna have to go back and finish that run one of these days as Corner brook was as far as I got. I had three weeks off at the time and it took me a week and a bit to get there so I figured I'd better turn around. Kind of a dumb move.
Sure appreciate the story Vince as I can really empathize with how it feels to drive a 50 year old car across the country. Kind of keeps you alert all day, thats for sure.
Do you still have the friend there? Yes, for sure.... Every Canadian should have the experience of driving at least once east/west-west/east across this vast country of ours!
The car actually drove great... I'm just a worry wart of sorts! And I know if I had to take something newer, that really drove great, I would have been bored and not so road conscious, that's for sure!
Have been enjoying the read as much as all the others. Thought I would do up the mileage for the trip so far, since you made mention of it a while back.
Started at 5426 on the odometer.
5669- 243 mi- 51L = 18mpg
5952- 283 mi- 62.49L =17.14mpg
6186 - 234 mi - 45.4L = 19.51 mpg
6251 - 65 mi - 15.3L = 16.08 mpg
6496 - 245 mi- 47.51L = 19.52 mpg
6708 - 212 mi - 44.27L = 18.13 mpg
6874 - 166 mi - 36.54L = 17.2 mpg
6954 - 80 mi - 21.3L = 14.24 mpg
7156 - 202 mi - 44L = 17.38 mpg
7378 - 222 mi - 43L = 19.54 mpg
7609 - 231 mi - 48L = 18.27 mpg
7795 - 189 mi- 45L = 15.6 mpg
8087 - 289 mi - 63.5L = 17.23 mpg
These are the mileages that are in the post at each full up. The average for the trip to this point is 17.52 mpg. This seems to me to pretty damn good for a 50 year old vehicle and 454 ci engine with a 4 bbl carb. i'm sure that the 700r4 would be helping out. Don't think it would be that good with the old 400.
Looking forward to the next installment of your trip Vince.
Luppy
Morning Luppy! Thanks for tallying that up for me... I was going to do it but had forgotten and got lost in posting about the trip... But, I have to ask, are you using the 3.785 U.S. Gallon instead of the 4.546L per Imperial gallon we use for your conversion? If so, this will look even better...
Started at 5426 on the odometer.
5669 - 243 mi - 55L = 20.08 mpg
5952 - 283 mi - 62.49L =20.58 mpg
6186 - 234 mi - 45.4L = 23.42 mpg
6251 - 65 mi - 15.27L = 19.35 mpg
6496 - 245 mi - 47.51L = 23.44 mpg
6708 - 212 mi - 44.27L = 21.77 mpg
6874 - 166 mi - 36.54L = 20.65 mpg
6954 - 80 mi - 21.3L = 17.06mpg
7156 - 202 mi - 44L = 20.88 mpg
7378 - 222 mi - 43L = 23.47 mpg
7609 - 231 mi - 48L = 21.88 mpg
7795 - 189 mi- 45L = 19.09 mpg
8087 - 289 mi - 63.5L = 20.67 mpg
Everyone else can re-confirm if I am doing the math correctly! (at 1am, I may not be)
I only checked the last fillup, the higher numbers is correct, impressive.
__________________
63 Parisienne sport coupe (The Big GTO), black, maroon interior, 409 4 speed; former owner of a 59 El Camino, 63 Corvette SWC, 62 Chev Bel Air SC. 1963- Pontiac top selling car in Canada
Mahone Bay, NS Still not old enough to need an automatic
Oh well, right! 
I walked through the ship to familiarize myself as I knew this would be the one I would take on my return trip..
