New ride, American but thought you'd find it interesting!

Urban_suburban · Poncho Master!

New ride, American but thought you'd find it interesting!

MC · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

North wrote:
They only made about 5,500 LeMans 4 door hardtops versus about 39,000 Catalina 4 door hardtops. What is really striking is that they made 15 2 door hardtop LeMans for each 4 door hardtop LeMans.

I think that back in those days midsize 2 doors were sporty cars but mid sized 4 doors were seen as poor mans family cars. The LeMans cost $280 less than the Catalina but if you ad back the cost of the 350 2bbl the difference drops to $170. For the average family car buyer $170 was a small amount ( less than 5% ) to step up to a much bigger and more solid car.

Mind you the LeMans has a higher trim level interior than the Catalina ( pleated seats, armrest etc).

As if it wasn't nice enough before, you've turned this into a real beauty! I've always had a soft spot for 4-door hardtops, they are definitely one of the rarer and most neglected body styles. And I can say rather confidently that I don't think we will ever see them again. Yours is one of the nicer examples that I've seen.

Re: mid-size 4-doors vs full size 4-doors... I wonder how the Canadian data stacks up for Beaumont vs full size? One would think in Canada that the ratio would be somewhat different as we've long been (and continue to be) more frugal buyers than our neighbors to the south. Likely due as much to the dollar exchange and higher taxation as it is to attitude and practicality.

NOS · Poncho Master!

MC wrote:
North wrote:
They only made about 5,500 LeMans 4 door hardtops versus about 39,000 Catalina 4 door hardtops. What is really striking is that they made 15 2 door hardtop LeMans for each 4 door hardtop LeMans.

I think that back in those days midsize 2 doors were sporty cars but mid sized 4 doors were seen as poor mans family cars. The LeMans cost $280 less than the Catalina but if you ad back the cost of the 350 2bbl the difference drops to $170. For the average family car buyer $170 was a small amount ( less than 5% ) to step up to a much bigger and more solid car.

Mind you the LeMans has a higher trim level interior than the Catalina ( pleated seats, armrest etc).
As if it wasn't nice enough before, you've turned this into a real beauty! I've always had a soft spot for 4-door hardtops, they are definitely one of the rarer and most neglected body styles. And I can say rather confidently that I don't think we will ever see them again. Yours is one of the nicer examples that I've seen.
Re: mid-size 4-doors vs full size 4-doors... I wonder how the Canadian data stacks up for Beaumont vs full size? One would think in Canada that the ratio would be somewhat different as we've long been (and continue to be) more frugal buyers than our neighbors to the south. Likely due as much to the dollar exchange and higher taxation as it is to attitude and practicality.

the Chevelles and Beaumonts 4 door hardtops were the Luxury 'export' cars for GM Canada,

North · Guru

Waldron supplied the correct style single exhaust which looked and sounded great and was easy to install by myself with just jack stands. The fullsize (canadian and American) are much trickier as they use a cross over that requires dropping steering linkage, the A body singly uses a Y pipe, whole thing took an hour including removing the old stuff.

I used the detailed shop manual clearance specs to install it exactly as the factory did, much nicer than that low dangly tailpipe that was on it when I picked up the car!

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North · Guru

Only major thing left is the back window area, bubbling under the factory vinyl top. No water staining inside (even the factory cardboard package tray is nice) so doesn't seem to have perforated anywhere but I've never had a pleasant surprise under those darn Cordova tops. Going to the bodyshop next month to remove the Cordova top and replace the windshield (chipped) with a new one. I have a really good metal guy, he will do whatever metal work may be needed (no filler of course).

He just finished doing the same thing under one of my GP's, same thing, completely rust free car with virgin floors and trunkpan looking like day 1 with factory original paint but the back window opening area needed several tiny patches to deal with heavy pitting.

CdnGMfan · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

North wrote:

That interior is straight outta Compton! biggrin

It is nice to see the car end up in the right hands. I mean what are the chances of anyone having the correct NOS mirror? Tending to the bubbling under the vinyl top seems like the right priority for sure. Who else would go with a swatch of NOS dark green vinyl? Sounds good! A correct tail pipe really is one of those details that stands out. The car is really gorgeous.

My real question is, why the TH400 over the TH350 when a/c is specified?

Todd, can we do a feature on a GM Canada captive import, the 1969 Le Mans hardtop sedan? It even has a wood-grained version of a Beaumont dash wink

A stretch, I know.

4SPEED427 · A Poncho Legend!

CdnGMfan wrote:

North wrote:

My real question is, why the TH400 over the TH350 when a/c is specified?

My first thought was maybe a TH400 had a more favourable first gear ratio but it's actually higher, not lower. So much for that idea. Or does the A/C car have a lower diff ratio so the TH400 balances out in that event?

North · Guru

For the AC triggering the use of the TH400 in Abodies there is no official answer. I can think of two possibilities:

First is that since the TH350 was lighter duty than the TH400 and it was brand new perhpas the inclusion of AC to the 350 2bbl increased the total weight (AC was 120 pounds or so) of the car and they had a theoretical limit for the use of the smaller trans related to some combination of engine torque and weight. The fact that the same engine in the firebird had the TH350 with or without AC might bear out this theory.

Second is that they had limited production capacity for the new TH350 and tried to balance out its use by limiting applications.

On paper both the A body and Fbirds had the same axle ratio use for this powertrain combo; 2.56 axle without AC and 2.73 with AC. However all of the 69 LeMans' with AC and the 2bbl I've gone through over the years had the 2.56 axle so maybe the brochures were inaccurate.

One hint of their intentions is that when you ordered AC with your 2bbl 350 on a A body with the three speed automatic the factory invoice will show the 351 code for the TH400 but the price charged was $205.92 which was the price of the 359 code TH350 rather than the normal $227.04 TH400 price.

North · Guru

Got the LeMans to the bodyshop this week and removed the cordova top, windshield and backglass, no bad surprises but a few pinholes around and inside of the backwindow channel. Windshield area was fine, the top wasn't the original (it was a black jobber top that had been dyed green. The guy who did the top back then had primered the whole roof (the Fremont factory tended to leave the roof almost bare steel under the Cordova tops) but he didn't seem to realize that his primer wasn't water proof so it fostered that rust in the back glass channel.

While they weld up those little holes up they will also address a few touchup needs in the limelight green. Hopefully I'll get it back in a few weeks to finish the mechanical needs and get it on the road. (I have a bunch of NOS bits it could use to be really tight like rotors, pads, lower ball joints, idler and a swaybar link kit).

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MC · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

Looking good! You sure know how to make a guy jealous with those sweet cars of yours!

I assume you're putting a new vinyl top back on?

North · Guru

Hi guys, I realized I never posted pics from after the body shop last summer. It came out nice, if you have a sharp eye you may notice I added a power antenna, I had a spare 69 GTO setup (4 door uses same unit as a 2 door) and figured since we were at the body shop it would be the perfect time to fill the antenna hole in the front fender.

Here are a few pics,

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Bill shuba · Guru

Wow very nice 4 doors caught myself thinking how cool they look,and reminded myself how old I am..they were not cool when I was younger,and ,than green yet !! times sure have changed..Very nice

long stroke · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

B.E.A.U.T.I.F.U.L. and thank you for appreciating that car for what it really is and not just a set of doors like some folks do. Cheers.

CdnGMfan · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

Outstanding save, John!

norontcan · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

That's a ride to be proud of.