Barn find 59 Parisienne 2 door hardtop

4SPEED427 · A Poncho Legend!

Barn find 59 Parisienne 2 door hardtop

Pontiacanada · A Poncho Legend!

MoboMac wrote:
Looks like a real solid Pontiac.

x2.

That interior colour scheme is too cool.

59paris · Addicted!

Carl Stevenson wrote:
Same old problem with it as most of the full size Canadian Pontiacs on here. Early generation car, late generation sized garage.

Forgive me if the answer is in this thread but I can't find it. How old is the paint? It looks really good.

Haha, yeah, it does fit in the garage pretty tightly..

Car was repainted in a shade close to the original colour back in the 1980´s, I would say, judging from the refinish label in the door jamb. Photos make It look better than it is, though. Paint is faded, matte and chipped especially on the hood and trunk. Sides are not bad at all. As far as I can see, there are traces of the original paint under the hood, as there even are factory markings in crayon with the paint code in some areas.

long stroke · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

Pontiacanada wrote:
Canadian Poncho wrote:

As you can tell by now, most of us are drooling all over that sweet 59 of yours. What an amazing find and thank you for keeping that 261 where it belongs. What are your plans, other than the 261 rebuild. Looking forward to any updates on your fine 59. Cheers. George

59paris · Addicted!

long stroke wrote:
Pontiacanada wrote:
Canadian Poncho wrote:

As you can tell by now, most of us are drooling all over that sweet 59 of yours. What an amazing find and thank you for keeping that 261 where it belongs. What are your plans, other than the 261 rebuild. Looking forward to any updates on your fine 59. Cheers. George

Actually, the plan is to keep the car all original, except for the 261! I would have liked to rebuild it and keep it, but the motor is not in the car... it was taken all apart and in three different locations at the sellers and his brothers places, missing some parts too.. I have located a period correct 283 and that is the way I will go.

-- Edited by 59paris on Saturday 6th of January 2018 09:37:03 AM

bjburnout · Uber Guru

59paris wrote:
I have located a period correct 283 and that is the way I will go.

-- Edited by 59paris on Saturday 6th of January 2018 09:37:03 AM

........better check your keyboard........while typing (I'm sure) 3 4 8 ......2 8 3 came up...... biggrin

..with the torque of a 348 even a low horse 280 (3 deuces) would really light this car up....just sayin'... smile

59paris · Addicted!

bjburnout wrote:
59paris wrote:
I have located a period correct 283 and that is the way I will go.

-- Edited by 59paris on Saturday 6th of January 2018 09:37:03 AM
........better check your keyboard........while typing (I'm sure) 3 4 8 ......2 8 3 came up......
..with the torque of a 348 even a low horse 280 (3 deuces) would really light this car up....just sayin'...

I know! That might be an option down the road. But I have access to a rebuilt 283, reliable and easy to maintain.. for now, I feel more like thats the way to go about making this car move under its own power.

Canadian Poncho · A Poncho Legend!

Here's a tri power 348 intake for when you do your swap smile

https://www.kijiji.ca/v-engines-and-engine-parts/mississauga-peel-region/chevrolet-348-intake/1319321336?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true

Looks like "Jimmie" is sellin' !

bjburnout · Uber Guru

59paris wrote:
bjburnout wrote:
59paris wrote:
I have located a period correct 283 and that is the way I will go.

-- Edited by 59paris on Saturday 6th of January 2018 09:37:03 AM
........better check your keyboard........while typing (I'm sure) 3 4 8 ......2 8 3 came up......
..with the torque of a 348 even a low horse 280 (3 deuces) would really light this car up....just sayin'...
I know! That might be an option down the road. But I have access to a rebuilt 283, reliable and easy to maintain.. for now, I feel more like thats the way to go about making this car move under its own power.

.....no problem 59Paris but just consider that when designing the 58/59/60's GM decided the 283 was not going to be

totally adequate to move these new behemoths and so they started an in-house competition for a new motor.

Engines were given designations and the 348 design was the 'W' motor and went on to infamy as the 409.....certainly it is

your choice for this spectacular resto but being a 'big block' kinda guy if it were mine there would be no question.

Enjoy this car it is truly one of a kind and I admire your efforts to get her going again.....I did the same for a 61 many years ago.

-Robert M- · Addicted!

I have 58 manual and 59 supplement.

If you need anything looked up and scanned in to you, please just holler.

I would be only too glad.

Robert

427carl · A Poncho Legend!

59paris wrote:
bjburnout wrote:
59paris wrote:
I have located a period correct 283 and that is the way I will go.

-- Edited by 59paris on Saturday 6th of January 2018 09:37:03 AM
........better check your keyboard........while typing (I'm sure) 3 4 8 ......2 8 3 came up......
..with the torque of a 348 even a low horse 280 (3 deuces) would really light this car up....just sayin'...
I know! That might be an option down the road. But I have access to a rebuilt 283, reliable and easy to maintain.. for now, I feel more like thats the way to go about making this car move under its own power.

My dads 1961 Strato Chief 261 auto was as fast as my friends Dads 283 stick . 261 with dual exhaust would be cool

MC · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

I understand the desire for a V8 - that has always been my favourite engine configuration.

However, one of the things that makes this a unique Canadian car is that it had a 261. I don't think you could even get a six in US Pontiacs at the time, and I would say a large chunk of Canadian cars had them back in the day, given that our economy was never what the American economy was at the time.

I'll also echo Carl's thoughts that a 261 has more power than you would expect it to - there's enough torque available to be able to drive it in modern traffic.

Just my 2¢, though, it's your car, your time, your money. Do what makes you happy! smile

And I agree that a W motor would be pretty cool as well! wink

58 poncho fan · Addicted!

Guess I might as well chime in also. My 58 Parisienne has its original 261 engine and I can also vouch for its

perfomance. Mind you at my age of just shy of 80 I am not a Hotrodder but every once in a while i will boot it

just to see what it can do. Lots of fun. Bob.

427carl · A Poncho Legend!

I just mentioned it, because the car is so complete, and you have the 261.... I'd have a 454 in it in a second . lol

-- Edited by 427carl on Saturday 6th of January 2018 08:40:09 PM

Canadian Poncho · A Poncho Legend!

Dave doesn't have the 261.

MoboMac · Poncho Master!

Great car and great thread......

Just a few comments....on the comments.....

This 59 should be considered a "tent find"....not a "barn find"... biggrin

58-64 X-frame cars are NOT big boats......they are normal sized cars.....that will seat 4 adults comfortably....without touching or smelling each other.......The oil companies have conditioned us to think that "sardine can sized" cars are normal.

They started to grow....and gain weight in 65.......and by the late 60's they WERE big boats...

I would guess that the 59 HT Parisienne likely tipped the scales at around 3700 lbs....which is prolly about 1500 lbs LESS... than your average SUV.......and I do know that a 283 2bbl. weighs slightly less than the inline 6.......and will get slightly BETTER gas mileage than the 6......while still making PLENTY of power to move the car (loaded) smartly over a mountain pass....and cruise at 65-70 mph all day long...

For the record......348's and 409's are NOT big blocks......They use the same motor mounts as a 283.......and a single exhaust Y-pipe...from a 283....also fits a 348......The heads are obviously bigger....but dimensionally the block will be similar to sbc...

OK....time for me to go out and shovel some rain.... smile

4SPEED427 · A Poncho Legend!

MoboMac wrote:
For the record......348's and 409's are NOT big blocks......They use the same motor mounts as a 283.......

That's good old GM interchangability for you, even 427's use 283 mounts.

bjburnout · Uber Guru

Carl Stevenson wrote:
MoboMac wrote:
For the record......348's and 409's are NOT big blocks......They use the same motor mounts as a 283.......

That's good old GM interchangability for you, even 427's use 283 mounts.

......but NOT the same frame mounts.......

4SPEED427 · A Poncho Legend!

Are they not back in the 348 days?

65-69 B body they are the same, small or big block.

bjburnout · Uber Guru

Carl Stevenson wrote:
Are they not back in the 348 days?

65-69 B body they are the same, small or big block.

.......except for the 307 I believe all GM V8 motor mounts are the same from 58 thru probably 69 or even a bit later,

however frame mounts between L6 and V8 are different due to the fact they determine how the motor sits on the frame ie; height.

when I converted a 61 Impala from L6 to V8 I had to c/o the frame mounts for proper positioning.

4SPEED427 · A Poncho Legend!

Yes, that makes sense, 6 cyl to V8, but on the X frame cars are you saying the frame mounts are not the same, 348/409 vs. 283/327?

4SPEED427 · A Poncho Legend!

Carl Stevenson wrote:

Are they not back in the 348 days?

65-69 B body they are the same, small or big block.

And I should have worded this post better, it was intended to mean both engine side and frame side mounts are the same, 65-69 big or small block.

DonSSDD · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

What BJ said is the frame mounts for all the V8's are the same, the 6's were taller.

Mobomac, a 348 and 409 are longer than a small block with the extra length in front of the motor mounts. That is why the 348/409 fan shroud is shorter than the small block fan shroud.

Exhaust pipe wise, manifolds to mufflers, I'm not sure if they are the same.The 409 was a direct bolt in when I changed it out into my 59 for a while, except for the exhaust. But in my case, the 283 was 2 inch and the 409 was 2.5 inch, so I needed new manifold pipes. The stock 348/409 manifolds may not exit directly down in the same place, that I don't know about. Bolt in wise, the bell housing, starter, clutch rods, z bar, motor and frame mounts, transmission mount, drive shaft, 59 generator with power steering (it needed a different bracket to mount it to the 409 manifold), I even used my small block pertronics in the 409 distributor. I used my stock 59 air cleaner, but with an adapter to fit the larger top on the AFB carb I have.

The 261 weighs more than the 283 and real close to a 348 or 409. If you have any problems with the cast iron glide, I'd consider changing it to the aluminum glide to save about 150 lbs I'd guess. The 261 with cast iron glide weighs more than a 348 or 409 with a 4 speed.

bjburnout · Uber Guru

59paris wrote:
I have located a period correct 283 and that is the way I will go.
**********
.. if you require an adapter for the V8 swap I'll let this one go pretty cheap..it works for 283 & 348

-- Edited by bjburnout on Sunday 7th of January 2018 10:17:08 AM

MoboMac · Poncho Master!

DonSSDD wrote:
What BJ said is the frame mounts for all the V8's are the same, the 6's were taller.

Mobomac, a 348 and 409 are longer than a small block with the extra length in front of the motor mounts. That is why the 348/409 fan shroud is shorter than the small block fan shroud.

Exhaust pipe wise, manifolds to mufflers, I'm not sure if they are the same.The 409 was a direct bolt in when I changed it out into my 59 for a while, except for the exhaust. But in my case, the 283 was 2 inch and the 409 was 2.5 inch, so I needed new manifold pipes. The stock 348/409 manifolds may not exit directly down in the same place, that I don't know about. Bolt in wise, the bell housing, starter, clutch rods, z bar, motor and frame mounts, transmission mount, drive shaft, 59 generator with power steering (it needed a different bracket to mount it to the 409 manifold), I even used my small block pertronics in the 409 distributor. I used my stock 59 air cleaner, but with an adapter to fit the larger top on the AFB carb I have.

The 261 weighs more than the 283 and real close to a 348 or 409. If you have any problems with the cast iron glide, I'd consider changing it to the aluminum glide to save about 150 lbs I'd guess. The 261 with cast iron glide weighs more than a 348 or 409 with a 4 speed.

Good call on upgrading to an aluminum glide......for weight savings....and serviceability....

About 5 years ago...I was giving some thoughts to replacing the 348 in my 59......with a 327.......and that's where I found out about the interchange info you posted.......As I recall.....I looked in an old Walker exhaust catalog.......and they listed the same Y-pipe part #......for BOTH 283...and 348 with single exhaust....(I realize that 409's DID use 2 1/2 " exhaust outlet)

Just A side note on Petronics.....I'd take that JUNK out of your distributor ...and re-install some good old made in USA points and condenser...

Aftermarket electronic ignition systems are almost ALWAYS the culprit......when a pre computer car DIES...or won't start....

They seem to go bad with AGE......regardless of how much run time is on them...

Pertonics has done a GREAT job....of selling their product....into a market where MOST people with old cars... don't know or understand how simple it is to change and maintain a points style ignition....

When they go bad......you are usually done....Time to call the tow truck....

With points....your engine will run poorly......for a long time....before it dies......basically telling you it needs service..