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Post Info TOPIC: Can anyone date code this engine number?


Canadian Poncho Superstar!

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Can anyone date code this engine number?


My 1963 Pontiac Parisienne has a 283 block number 9V280505 

I'm thinking it may not be the original motor for the car.

Can anyone tell me if this is a 1963 built engine, if not, what year would it most likely be from.

Also what was the motor # range for motors built in 1963.

Thanks,

-G



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Poncho Master!

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George, check the casting number behind the driver side head, there is a date code there too. That is a Cdn engine stamp code. The date codes on the heads and intake and block should be in a similar range if they are original.

GM historical documents for your serial number will have the matching code for your block. Good idea to get them and that would tell you 100% its the block the car was built with.




-- Edited by DonSSDD on Tuesday 14th of July 2020 03:01:51 AM

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63 Parisienne sport coupe (The Big GTO), black, maroon interior, 409 4 speed; former owner of a 59 El Camino, 63 Corvette SWC, 62 Chev Bel Air SC. 

Mahone Bay, NS Still not old enough to need an automatic



Poncho Master!

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Also, they may tell you on the phone what your engine code is after you place your order, rather than having to wait until a package comes in the mail.

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63 Parisienne sport coupe (The Big GTO), black, maroon interior, 409 4 speed; former owner of a 59 El Camino, 63 Corvette SWC, 62 Chev Bel Air SC. 

Mahone Bay, NS Still not old enough to need an automatic



Canadian Poncho Superstar!

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George, the 9V28505 number, is that a stamping? If so, is it on the block ahead of the passenger side head?

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Canadian Poncho Superstar!

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That's the one Clint. Actual stamped as opposed to being cast in the block. 9V280505

The question has been asked a number of times on the site as to what the 9V at the front of the number means

Never seen an answer to that question.

I've seen a large number of Canadian engines start with the 9V designation so it must represent something.

Anybody know ?

I think Don's on the right track....finding  the date code that is cast behind the driver side head
will at least tell me when the block was made. If that date in the casting is close to
the date codes cast in the heads and intake then that will tell when the motor was made.
If those dates are late 1962 and 1963,then I can assume the motor is original.
 
As for getting information from GM Historical Documents, from what I know (I could be wrong)
these documents weren't recorded and made available until after the 1964 production year started.
So earlier years weren't recorded or available.
Has anyone with a GM car older than 1964 ever received matching
numbers information from GM Historical Documents for their car ?
Thanks for the input.
-G


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Poncho Master!

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What you get for a 63 and earlier is a letter like this one below from my 62 Bel Air, 64 and later you get something similar to a build sheet. I have this for my 63, just can't find a pic of it at this minute.

 

fullsizeoutput_284.jpeg



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63 Parisienne sport coupe (The Big GTO), black, maroon interior, 409 4 speed; former owner of a 59 El Camino, 63 Corvette SWC, 62 Chev Bel Air SC. 

Mahone Bay, NS Still not old enough to need an automatic



Poncho Master!

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The 9V may mean a V8, my other 62 was a six, it had an engine number of 9654915, no V. Maybe the 9 means Cdn, the 6 a six and the V a V8? George, with the GM package you also get a set of factory specs for the 63, its a package about 20 pages or so.

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63 Parisienne sport coupe (The Big GTO), black, maroon interior, 409 4 speed; former owner of a 59 El Camino, 63 Corvette SWC, 62 Chev Bel Air SC. 

Mahone Bay, NS Still not old enough to need an automatic



Canadian Poncho Superstar!

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Don,

Thanks very much for this detailed information.

You have convinced me.

I didn't think the engine number would be on the sheet before 63, but there it is.

I'll order up the documents.

Thanks again,

-G



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Addicted!

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Hi there, I'll chime in and say that my car is an original 63.My info is the same as Don's from VVS except for the model of course and the 63 being the 195hp 2bbl Strato Flash. That number stamped into the block in frt of the passenger side head is the one that will ID your motor as original to your car. The casting number behind the driver side head tells you that it is a 283 only. The date code on my engine block is a widely spaced set of numbers in the side of the block just behind/above the starter. I just bought another original 63 283 out of a Laurentian for the top end (intake and carb) and air cleaner. I checked all the numbers and except for the individual ID stamped near the pass head, this engine presents exactly as the one in my Parisienne. Now I'm not sure but the 9V my indicate that the blocks were actually cast at Flint. Hope this helps some. By the way ,you can date code the carb and intake too!

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Since they weren't stamping vins on the engines until 1968, any engine from the same batch is numbers-matching. My '67 with the later style engine code could technically have any K1212CQ engine from any car produced close to the same time. Often various engine codes are produced in batches on different dates. The order comes in, "We need a batch of 250 Powerglides". Built 12-12-66 in St. Catharine & met up with a body & rest of the car in Oshawa starting the 13th. It rolled off the line on the 15th & was shipped at once. That is as tight as it gets. Some less popular engine codes may sit for months in the bank. Oshawa just sat on the 1964-made 1965 409s until they ran out sometime in the spring I think.

 

1963 Canadian engine codes really confuse me.



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Poncho Master!

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In Chevies, the high hp engines had partial vins starting in 62 or maybe before in corvette , a 250 hp 327 didnt have it, the 300 hp did in 62. USA rules, not sure about Canada.

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63 Parisienne sport coupe (The Big GTO), black, maroon interior, 409 4 speed; former owner of a 59 El Camino, 63 Corvette SWC, 62 Chev Bel Air SC. 

Mahone Bay, NS Still not old enough to need an automatic



Poncho Master!

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Beginning in 1955 GM Canada used 9V to identify the powertrain as a V8 Automatic. 9 =powerglide V = 8 cylinder. These engines were made at Mckinnion Industries. The following numbers are the sequence number of V8 engines produced at the plant.

Al

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Poncho Master!

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Taylor55 wrote:

Beginning in 1955 GM Canada used 9V to identify the powertrain as a V8 Automatic. 9 =powerglide V = 8 cylinder. These engines were made at Mckinnion Industries. The following numbers are the sequence number of V8 engines produced at the plant.

Al


 Al, so the following numbers were sequential from 1955 on? If someone tracked those numbers, along with build dates on those attached to a vehicle, you could get pretty close on build dates for engines not attached to a vehicle?

And these numbers were sequential for engines built by McKinnon, so they would be installed in a Chev or Pontiac, whichever car they happened to get attached to? And did these engines go into Beaumonts and Chevelles etc as well?

Don



-- Edited by DonSSDD on Wednesday 22nd of July 2020 10:24:26 AM

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63 Parisienne sport coupe (The Big GTO), black, maroon interior, 409 4 speed; former owner of a 59 El Camino, 63 Corvette SWC, 62 Chev Bel Air SC. 

Mahone Bay, NS Still not old enough to need an automatic



Poncho Master!

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Yes the engines were sequence numbered from Mckinnion Industries regardless from which car they were installed Chevrolet , Pontiac, etc. There is a website that documents sequence numbers from Mckinnion for every year they built small block engines. I had it saved but somehow lost it. It was documented by engine number for every engine from first engine manufactured to last one for every year with all sequence numbers provided. I have an early 1957 283 that I id through the list. The list was provided by an Americian who was identifing all the differences between americian built Chevys and Canadian cars.

Al

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Poncho Master!

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Interesting, thanks Al.

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63 Parisienne sport coupe (The Big GTO), black, maroon interior, 409 4 speed; former owner of a 59 El Camino, 63 Corvette SWC, 62 Chev Bel Air SC. 

Mahone Bay, NS Still not old enough to need an automatic



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IMG_0097.jpgIMG_0222.jpgIMG_0165.jpgWoops,guess I blew it on the Flint thingy.lol I think later on in the sixties a "V" indicated Flint. So I've read that McKinnon motors were cast with a "K". When would that have been because my 283 has the "M" in a little square.I'll post these pics of the 283 block casting number,M and date code.



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Veteran Member

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The K is in the build stamping. Flint used F, Flint V8 used V, Tonawanda used T and Mckinnon/St Catharines used K. I don't think Flint cast blocks, I think they were cast at the Central Foundry (Saginaw?). McKinnon and Tonawanda did.

I'm not sure either why the early Michigan (Flint area) Small Block V8 had F on them. V was used later as otus says. Not sure if the V meant V8 or Van Slyke Road which is where the Flint V8 small block plant was built.

That cast date Otus put up is the easiest way to pick a McKinnon/St Catharine's block when its covered in crud at the back. Tonawanda and Flint are at the back area near where the McKinnion M is. Flint V8 SBC I normally pick by the oil gallery plug up under the front of the manifold above the water pump. Tonawanda advertise with the big T.

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