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Post Info TOPIC: '64 CS signal/brake light problem


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'64 CS signal/brake light problem


Three years ago I installed a new signal light switch and cancelling cam in my non-tilt '64 CS.  All has worked well until a couple of weeks ago.  My driver's side rear signal light and brake light no longer work but the driver's front signal light works as it should.  The passenger side is also fine, both front and rear.  I concluded that the signal light switch may be bad so I purchased a new one last week.  Instead of going to all the work of threading it though the steering column, I simply connected it to the two appropriate plugs and tested it.  The driver's side signal light now flashed on the front and on the rear but I still have no left brake light.  All of the fuses in the fuse block are working fine.  I even changed the flasher to no avail.  I also ran a hot wire from the battery to the wire that leads from the brake light switch to the rear but only the right brake light comes on.  I realize that the signal light and brake light share the same filament and wire.  Also, the park lights, tail lights, and headlights are all working fine.  I also put new 1157  bulbs in the driver's rear sockets.  If anyone as any suggestions, I would very much appreciate your ideas.  Thanks.



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According to the wiring diagram, there should be a connector in the trunk area. Check for corrosion.F90BBA70-3390-444E-9BE1-67356164D4FE.jpegB30192F1-55B0-4C57-A3BE-7DD4F3EF32D9.jpegD9F9010C-0A35-4712-AA67-C7C1358BE7A6.jpegCC020CC1-AAB4-47BE-8F64-3EAF32130F2E.jpeg



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pontiax- (canadian pontiac X frame)1964 Parisienne 2dr. hdtop lagoon aqua metallic (Q)

 



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Thanks for the diagrams and suggestion, Pete. I will check this out.

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'76 Cougar XR7 (original owner); '52 Mercury Monterey 2 dr HT (Future Project)

2013 Mustang

2010 Ford Ranger

'93 MX5

'64 Custom Sport Ragtop (Factory M20)



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Could be a ground or loose connection. The brake light work both lights at once whereas a signal light is only one bulb at a time so half the load on the wiring. These bulbs draw a lot of power so the grounds have to be solid and the way they are made, the fronds are often the problem.

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63 Parisienne sport coupe (The Big GTO), black, maroon interior, 409 4 speed; former owner of a 59 El Camino, 63 Corvette SWC, 62 Chev Bel Air SC.
1963- Pontiac top selling car in Canada

Mahone Bay, NS Still not old enough to need an automatic



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Probe the sockets with power applied at the column connector



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65 Laurentian post, 67 Grande Parisienne 4 door HT. 
 


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I have come across this before chances are is a piece of junk aftermarket switch that you have and the contacts are toast already. I cant recall the last one I purchased was but the contacts were much better and it has been problem free. The first couple I went through were both problematic and the contacts kept bending and stopped making contact in the switch

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I had a repro switch like that years ago too. Finally ended up taking my original apart, cleaning and rebending all the contact points and put it back in. Worked perfectly. In the meantime out of frustration I'd ordered an NOS piece so it became a spare. That repro piece was pathetic.

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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 44,000 original miles "FAKE_66"



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I did this exact thing on my 65 this spring Carl. Yes, the aftermarket switch contacts are garbage and needed some real tweaking to make contact. 

Even made a small diagram of it to see it's function and to see how the brake/signal overlap works.. Not sure if 64 is the same?

51079467177_e87f747fdf_z.jpg



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65 Laurentian post, 67 Grande Parisienne 4 door HT. 
 


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Thanks, Mark. Yes, that diagram and switch look the same. Thank you to all who have replied to this post and for the private messages. I sincerely appreciate all of the suggestions and especially value your support in finding the problem. I have yet another new switch arriving tomorrow. I ordered one from Standard Motor Products out of Long Island City, NY. I will do a quick connection under the dash to see if it resolves the issue. Hopefully, it will work and I can then pull the steering wheel and thread it down the column as I have done with the other 3 new ones. I quite agree that the contacts in these switches are made from inferior materials, especially the ones "off the boat from you know where." These wiring issues are frustrating, but then again it is a 57 year old car. It has been a great, warm summer for cruising here in Saskatchewan. I have put just over 1800 miles on my CS and, after repairing this issue, hope to log a few more miles before winter storage.

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'76 Cougar XR7 (original owner); '52 Mercury Monterey 2 dr HT (Future Project)

2013 Mustang

2010 Ford Ranger

'93 MX5

'64 Custom Sport Ragtop (Factory M20)



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I bet you have no/poor contact with "A" or "E" the left rear switch prong. I chased this exact issue with my switch. I narrowed it to the switch when I put 12v to the black/yellow lead at the plug and the brake/signal filament lit.

Happy to hear you're narrowing it down.

 



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65 Laurentian post, 67 Grande Parisienne 4 door HT. 
 


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It was a great daysmile  My driver's rear tail light and signal light issue on my '64 CS has been resolved.  As many of you (and I) suspected, it was indeed a poorly made signal light switch.  My new signal light switch arrived this morning and, after doing a quick test by simply plugging it in under the dash and testing it out, I confirmed the old switch was the problem.  I pulled the steering wheel and switch and installed the new one.  Everything now works as it should, including the signal light indicators on the dash.  Hopefully, this one will last more than three years.  Again, thank you very much to all of you who took the time to offer great recommendations, pictures, schematics, and trouble shooting ideas. 

Take care,

Brian



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'76 Cougar XR7 (original owner); '52 Mercury Monterey 2 dr HT (Future Project)

2013 Mustang

2010 Ford Ranger

'93 MX5

'64 Custom Sport Ragtop (Factory M20)



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Excellent! And thanks for reporting on this. It may help others in the future.

Repro. Gotta love it but I guess we need to be happy there's at least something available for our old cars.



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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 44,000 original miles "FAKE_66"



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Glad you got it! 

Note to all; never chuck out that old original switch, you just might need it for parts.



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65 Laurentian post, 67 Grande Parisienne 4 door HT. 
 


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Awesome. Fingers crossed you get more than three years this time

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And now, a week before the safety on the 65...guess which switch is giving me trouble?

No left rear brake or signal. I'm betting on terminal "E" loosing contact. Hopefully I can tweak it into contact wiithout removing the switch. Maybe some contact cleaner and copper contact paste. I don't want to pull the switch again. From the images I can find, it looks like pin E is accessible with the signal lever up.

sw.JPG



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65 Laurentian post, 67 Grande Parisienne 4 door HT. 
 


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Mark, to use one of my favorite expressions, I would have to say, "buggernuts!" I certainly hope that your helping me with my problem did not jinx your '65. You definitely have the knowledge and skills to trace this problem which, as you mentioned, is most likely the contacts, particularly E. I agree that you should be able to get at these contacts without removing the switch. When I installed mine yesterday, I simply separated the three sections on my column and was then able to thread the new plugs and wires through them. The entire process took about 20 minutes from start to finish. Mind you, mine is a 4 speed so I did not have any other obstacles to deal with on the column. It would be great if there were enough slack in the wire coming up the column to allow you to simply unscrew the switch and take a good look at the contacts by removing them. Given all the work you have been doing on this Pontiac, including lights and such, I am optimistic that you will have a positive update in a matter of hours. I do wish you success.smile



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'76 Cougar XR7 (original owner); '52 Mercury Monterey 2 dr HT (Future Project)

2013 Mustang

2010 Ford Ranger

'93 MX5

'64 Custom Sport Ragtop (Factory M20)



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Thanks Brian.

Of course now I can't find my little homemade steering wheel puller, so another little job.



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Trouble light lit when I probed pin "E" with the brake pedal depressed, so the switch wasn't the issue.

Do moving downstream, testing ok from the switch pin "E" to the column plug switchside B/Yellow, and from the bodyplug B/Yellow to the rear lamps, it turns out the B/Yellow Packard connector on the switch side of the plug had simply pushed back. The small little barb on the top of the connector had flattened and wasn't grabbing in the connector socket.

So the connector can cause some confusion as well.



-- Edited by cdnpont on Wednesday 15th of September 2021 04:19:44 PM

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65 Laurentian post, 67 Grande Parisienne 4 door HT. 
 


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Excellent detective work, Mark. That certainly did not take you long. Nice job on the wheel puller too. Best of luck with the inspection next week

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'76 Cougar XR7 (original owner); '52 Mercury Monterey 2 dr HT (Future Project)

2013 Mustang

2010 Ford Ranger

'93 MX5

'64 Custom Sport Ragtop (Factory M20)

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