I NEED help, please

hsebastian · Member

I NEED help, please

unruhjonny · Guru

egads.

This reads like lawyer territory to me;
I really hope someone here can chime in with advice.

DonSSDD · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

Take it from whoever has it would be what I would do. Get possession then figure out what you do next.

hsebastian · Member

I can't take it back. It is in pieces in a locked place and I have no way of collecting it.

CdnGMfan · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

Do you have a contract, Yes or No?

DonSSDD · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

Id tell the shop to stop working they are talking $97,000 plus $43,000 already spent to see the car finished. And the $97,000 will likely go up? Have you been provided with an itemized list of what has been done and what needs to be done? Post pictures of the current condition and or any in progress pictures you have so we can see the details.

Id still be getting it out of this shop- because you cant afford another $97,000 if for no other reason. Tell them you want to arrange to have it removed and see what happens.

MikeR667 · Veteran Member

This is what I went through. Nothing was being done. My money was being spent. Quotes going larger. Car was in locked in spot and every thing disassembled. My money was gone and basically was the car.
I went there with a tow truck and a box truck with a lift gate.. I had the flat bed take the frame and body. And I went with extra bins and a dolly and put the remaining pieces in the extra boxes and in the box truck. I even put the transmission and engine in the box truck. and got my car the hell out of that shop.

unruhjonny · Guru

I would tend to agree with what these guys are saying;
Right now, do what ever you can to get it out of there, and try to ensure that everything is still there.

After you get the car back in your possession, move to what ever the next step might be.

I would think (hope?) that you should have some sort of paperwork authorizing for the initial $25k worth of work, but am unclear on how you've gotten to spending $46k;
what ever the case, get it out of there.

NOS · Poncho Master!

save all the invoices and pictures of the job and conversations . Make copies of every thing ,

dale

-- Edited by NOS on Wednesday 22nd of November 2023 04:45:30 PM

oshawacliff · Poncho Master!

Have you ever kept a file of invoices

Do you have receipts for the moneys paid.

Investigate buying/renting a 40 foot trailer to store whatever you recover.

Any chance there will be a lien placed on your vehicle.

What is the "GIVE ME BACK MY CAR PRICE?

WISH YOU LUCK ON THIS.

Dont get physical but do get a lawyer. Maybe even a tow truck to accompany you when you insist on your vehicle.

Have you ever had an official appraisal.

Cliff

Is there a Better Business that will listen to your claim

-- Edited by oshawacliff on Wednesday 22nd of November 2023 04:47:24 PM

Canadian Poncho · A Poncho Legend!

May need to get the media involved.

oshawacliff · Poncho Master!

Heather

Welcome to CP from the Wet Coast

A resource for all our members.

Hope our guidance will be a benefit to you. Ask away

ak 67sd · Poncho Master!

What province and city are you in? This might help with advice. I've never had to deal with something like this, but the best advice is to document like crazy and get your car out of there. Did they also send things out for repair that are not there? Engine rebuild? Chroming? Etc. Hopefully there's something to show for $43000!! So sorry this is happening to you. ak

oshawacliff · Poncho Master!

Heather

Do a search for classic car inspection companies in bc canada

A number show up.

There is also in Ontario a company called P.A.V.E 1 416 252 3983

Dean Renwick is president.

A lot of reading but it may be worth it.

PROFESSIONALis not only the first word in our name; but it is also an accurate description of the level of service provided by all members of the Professional Association of Vehicle Evaluators Inc., P.A.V.E.

P.A.V.E. is a Canadian organization with a mandate to qualify, train, license, regulate, discipline and insure vehicle appraisers. P.A.V.E. is governed by an experienced, expert Board of Advisors and has a Peer Review Committee to ensure that a high level of product quality control and ethical behaviour as defined by the P.A.V.E. Code of Ethics is followed

P.A.V.E. is the only source of vehicle appraiser licensing in Ontario. P.A.V.E. members have a broad range of vehicle expertise from new cars and trucks, to modified rat rods and pick-ups, classic cars of all ages, to post-war collectibles combined with a wide range of appraisal expertise including the preparation of basic insurance appraisals, after-loss valuations, disputes with insurance companies, diminished value negotiations, and expert witness experience in courts appearing for various matters including divorce and estate valuations and restoration shop disputes.

Since 2000 P.A.V.E. has ensured both its members and appraisal consumers are protected under a unique Professional Errors and Omissions (E&O) insurance program. In 2019 P.A.V.E.s unique group insurance program to which all licensed members subscribe was expanded to include Comprehensive General Liability (CGL) coverage, and Directors and Officers (D&O) protection.

P.A.V.E. members are totally independent. Our clients include private individuals, members of the legal professional, the federal Canadian Cultural Heritage Export Review Board (CCPERB), and insurance companies.

P.A.V.E. was founded in 1996 by Dean Renwick who remains President and Chief Executive of P.A.V.E.

Pave has many members covering a broad range of subjects. Might be worth a phone call to see if they can offer assistance as there are a number of Auto Appraisal company in the BC search area.

Cliff

-- Edited by oshawacliff on Thursday 23rd of November 2023 05:19:52 PM

oshawacliff · Poncho Master!

Heather: YOu first posted about your car in 2009. Was it roadworthy and insured for the road.

Have you kept up the insurance even though it is not roadworthy.

Its almost midnight and my mind wont stop.......

Wish you the best

-- Edited by oshawacliff on Thursday 23rd of November 2023 12:19:10 PM

seventy2plus2 · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

ak 67sd wrote:
What province and city are you in? This might help with advice. I've never had to deal with something like this, but the best advice is to document like crazy and get your car out of there. Did they also send things out for repair that are not there? Engine rebuild? Chroming? Etc. Hopefully there's something to show for $43000!! So sorry this is happening to you. ak

Her ID indicates she's in Vancouver BC.

norontcan · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

Stories like this make my blood boil. Unfortunately they are all too common.

Sadly there are a number of " restoration " shops and this is the only thing that they are good at. I can name you at least 2 in this area of Ontario. Not to discourage you, and your lawyer, but they are used to having to defend themselves and know most of the ropes.

I wish you luck.

-- Edited by norontcan on Thursday 23rd of November 2023 03:36:03 PM

oshawacliff · Poncho Master!

No replies from BC?

hawkeye5766 · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

hsebastian wrote:

I have owned a 1969 Beaumont Deluxe for about fifteen years. I saved and scrimped and had enough money (plus extra because everything costs more in the end) and finally took my car to someone who seemed to be trustworthy. The initial $25,000 estimate grew to $35,000 while I was waiting to have the work done. When the started to take it apart, they found plenty of hidden rust (not a surprise) and the numbers kept climbing. When I was told it might get to $60,000 but they would do their best to keep the costs down, I told them I was at the end of my resources and please do. I have paid $43,000 so far and it's been over a year.
Recently I asked them to provide me with a breakdown of the remaining costs, thinking I would take it somewhere else for paint and interior work. and after some delay, the new number is $97,000!!!
It get worse ... that doesn't include what I have already paid!!!
I have looked at the itemized list and find it unbelievable.
Do I hire a lawyer? Does anyone have any helpful advice?

Have been through this back in the 80's. Count your loses and pull out or it will keep costing you more. Back then I kept buying material and labour for my project and he/(the shop) kept putting my material on other peoples cars!!!!! This was when I started educating myself. Boddy men said it couldn't be saved ( my 57}! Lawyers and law suits just cost you $$$. If you have a legal title.....just pick up your car ,count your losses and move on. Sad to say..but no one is going to help you but yourself. So......pull it out and have a fresh start or continue with the ongoing saga. I showed up with a truck and trailer at the guys house when he was at work (was in his back yard) and yanked {my 57 }home!!!! Hope it all works out well 4 u in the end. Please keep us posted and all the best on your ongoing saga!

-- Edited by hawkeye5766 on Saturday 25th of November 2023 02:39:31 PM

timbuk · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

these stories truly suck thats alot of money for a a body resto hopefully you know a car person who could look over whats happened to this point and can help out, that price is insane

oshawacliff · Poncho Master!

hawkeye5766 wrote:
hsebastian wrote:

I have owned a 1969 Beaumont Deluxe for about fifteen years. I saved and scrimped and had enough money (plus extra because everything costs more in the end) and finally took my car to someone who seemed to be trustworthy. The initial $25,000 estimate grew to $35,000 while I was waiting to have the work done. When the started to take it apart, they found plenty of hidden rust (not a surprise) and the numbers kept climbing. When I was told it might get to $60,000 but they would do their best to keep the costs down, I told them I was at the end of my resources and please do. I have paid $43,000 so far and it's been over a year.
Recently I asked them to provide me with a breakdown of the remaining costs, thinking I would take it somewhere else for paint and interior work. and after some delay, the new number is $97,000!!!
It get worse ... that doesn't include what I have already paid!!!
I have looked at the itemized list and find it unbelievable.
Do I hire a lawyer? Does anyone have any helpful advice?

Have been through this back in the 80's. Count your loses and pull out or it will keep costing you more. Back then I kept buying material and labour for my project and he/(the shop) kept putting my material on other peoples cars!!!!! This was when I started educating myself. Boddy men said it couldn't be saved ( my 57}! Lawyers and law suits just cost you $$$. If you have a legal title.....just pick up your car ,count your losses and move on. Sad to say..but no one is going to help you but yourself. So......pull it out and have a fresh start or continue with the ongoing saga. I showed up with a truck and trailer at the guys house when he was at work (was in his back yard) and yanked {my 57 }home!!!! Hope it all works out well 4 u in the end. Please keep us posted and all the best on your ongoing saga!

-- Edited by hawkeye5766 on Saturday 25th of November 2023 02:39:31 PM

A Vancouver members thoughts are right on.

Heather Update please.

seventy2plus2 · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

I've been trying to figure out how to reply to Heather's original post. Here we go:

What work / parts was the original $25K then $35K quote for?
You've paid them $43K, what work & parts was that for, and has that work been done and parts provided?
What do they want the remaining $97K for?

I'd presume they don't do anything without being paid, so I assume they've done the work & provided parts for the $43K. You should then be within your rights to pick up the car and get it out of there.

Sounds to me like they're doing a complete frame off restoration, whereas you wanted something less than that. However, when I read your profile, you indicate you were aiming for a "off body" (I presume you mean body off) restoration. That's wasn't going to happen at $25K, and not even at $35K.

-- Edited by seventy2plus2 on Sunday 26th of November 2023 06:08:49 PM

hsebastian · Member

No - he said he could only give a rough estimate until the work started - here I am

hsebastian · Member

As I understand it, I am paid in full for the work done and it has a new floor and trunk bed and is completely disassembled, which makes it very difficult to just go get it. I asked what he would charge to rust protect the metal (one option) or to complete the car to priming (this takes $25,000 of the end price, which if it was double the one he suggested I might buy, would leave me at $65,000 - I wonder about everything at this point) and so far no reply at all.

I don't know what he is thinking or how to proceed from here.

I do have a meeting with a lawyer tomorrow to discuss my options and will keep it short, hopefully with some idea of my rights here.

hsebastian · Member

When he made his original verbal estimate, we both knew the floor was rusty and would need to be replaced. I was prepared for some increase of cost, because nearly everything costs more than we think it will.

At this point I am trying to sort out how to get it back and then I need to find someone who can put it back together.

I am taking a welding program at BCIT and can switch to autobody work and offer to help as much as I can if someone wants to take this on.

Alternatively, I will be thankful to find someone who can do it from this point - I have a ton of pictures of where things are now.