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Post Info TOPIC: Let's play "What happened here"


A Poncho Legend!

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Let's play "What happened here"


And I don't have the answer, only the problem.

A couple of months ago I had to do pretty much a panic stop with my Strato Chief. At that time it did great and avoided a bad situation but the brake pedal did a tiny lurch towards the floor for about 1/2 an inch when I was pushing hard on it. 

Since then, I've noticed nothing out of the ordinary, brakes felt good. However, on Thursday night I was driving the 4 blocks to our cruise night, approached a stop sign at maybe 20 miles an hour and when I stepped on the brake it gave that same lurch as if it was going to go to the floor but didn't, it stopped fine. It seemed like I could hear a very slight noise in one of the wheels (wasn't sure if it was front or back wheel) when I drove after that happened.

Today I decided to see if I could find a problem. I had to flip the pair of 66's around so I could get this car on the hoist. I drove the car out, parked it on our sloped driveway and pushed the park brake down like I always do. Right away I noticed the park brake went down farther than I'm used to. Aha, certainly going to pull the rear drums first.

Put it on the hoist, and decided I could see if one park brake cable was pulling more than the other maybe? Sure enough, when I marked the cables and set the park brake the left side cable came out a lot more than the right side.

I pulled the left drum and found this. 

Why and how did this happen?

20241014_171918[1].jpg

20241014_171928[1].jpg



-- Edited by 4SPEED427 on Monday 14th of October 2024 06:32:05 PM

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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles 

1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars (now converted to a "factory" 4 speed)



Uber Guru

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Let's play


Looks like the retainer for the E-brake cable spring retainer was not properly crimped by the manufacturer.

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Canadian Poncho Superstar!

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Let's play "What happened here"


It hard to believe a starwheel adjuster could pop out like that. Like get itself out and around from that lower spring tension.

Maybe the adjuster just got so loose (failed to adjust) that it did pop out (one side) when you vigorously set the parking brake. Picture the shoes expanding out when you set the brake, with a starwheel being stuck retracted, it could simply fall out or be pushed out by the adjustment lever.

Then for whatever reason, over time that adjuster lever began to actually work the starwheel again expanding it back out. Hence the impossible image.

 

I had a strange issue with the 69 this spring where the parking brake went suddenly slack. Turns out the parking brake adjustment lever in the assembly (the one that grabs the cable end) had popped up and come right around onto the shoe frame. It was lodged between the starwheel lever and the shoe itself. Basically stuck there. No idea how it did that.



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 67 Grande Parisienne 4 door HT. 69 Parisienne Convertible.
 


A Poncho Legend!

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cdnpont wrote:

It hard to believe a starwheel adjuster could pop out like that. Like get itself out and around from that lower spring tension.

Maybe the adjuster just go so loose (failed to adjust) that it did pop out (one side) when you vigorously set the parking brake. Picture the shoes expanding out when you set the brake, with a starwheel being stuck retracted, it could simply fall out or be pushed out by the adjustment lever.

Then for whatever reason, over time that adjuster lever began to actually work the starwheel again expanding it back out. Hence the impossible image.

 


 As I read this over, I can totally picture what you described. I bet you nailed it 100% Mark. And as you say, it struck me as odd that the starwheel was turned out so far. I had to spin it way in to get the drum to fit over the shoes once I had everything back in place. 

Like you say, it's hard to picture the adjuster coming out when the spring is still in place. those springs aren't weak, they keep the shoes pulled in real well at the bottom. 

One thing I've learned is to never say never, and this is a perfect illustration of something that could never happen actually happening.



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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles 

1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars (now converted to a "factory" 4 speed)



Canadian Poncho Superstar!

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as well as ajuster out is the bar at the top disengaged from the right shoe?



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A Poncho Legend!

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Yes, I was so focused on the adjuster I forgot to mention that. That will be why the park brake cable was able to pull out farther than on the right side.



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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles 

1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars (now converted to a "factory" 4 speed)



Canadian Poncho Superstar!

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I thought the link might be off as well. But does it not just fit into the PB lever (not the shoe itself)?

You know, it's easy to overlook the drums as we really don't put the miles on these cars we once did. Nobody likes or takes any joy in opening them up for an inspection. But they really need a good look every couple of years don't they. 



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 67 Grande Parisienne 4 door HT. 69 Parisienne Convertible.
 
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cdnpont wrote:

I thought the link might be off as well. But does it not just fit into the PB lever (not the shoe itself)?

You know, it's easy to overlook the drums as we really don't put the miles on these cars we once did. Nobody likes or takes any joy in opening them up for an inspection. But they really need a good look every couple of years don't they. 


 I have it all back together now but it seems to me on the back shoe it is the shoe and lever, on the front shoe it's the shoe only.

The thing is, I did back shoes on the car when I got it in 2016. It had a leaky cylinder so I did shoes and cylinders. I'm wondering if I missed something then when I put it together but it's a bit hard to imagine it took about 5000 miles and 8 years of driving for it to show up. And up until now the park brake worked great. Today when I got in the car to back it up the driveway after parking it in gear with the park brake on, I put the clutch in to start the car (without releasing the park brake) and it rolled towards the street. That has never happened before, the park brake has always held fine. I often started the car, put it in neutral and let it run on the driveway with just the park brake holding it, never an issue. Today it rolled the instant I released the clutch before starting it.



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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles 

1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars (now converted to a "factory" 4 speed)



Poncho Master!

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cdnpont wrote:

It hard to believe a starwheel adjuster could pop out like that. Like get itself out and around from that lower spring tension.

 

That was the very first thing I noticed was the adjuster was  so "far out". That would have meant your shoes and the drums were at their limit. But knowing you , Carl, you would not have put it back together without installing new parts.

Another possibility  is... the adjuster is wrong. 

 

 



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