In this post I'll try to document the refurbishing and (I hope) installation of a 6 way power seat in my 67 Grande.
I picked up this unit a few years ago. It was included with a complete full size front bench, the vintage of which I'm unsure, although from the pattern on the seat, I think it was an Olds (or Buick) of some type. The unit was pretty dirty, but the cables appeared to be in very good shape with no cracking of the sheathing. I did attempt twice to to supply power to the unit to see if it would drive, but only a click from the relay was heard. As well, the center knob on the switch had broken off and the rest of the switch felt bad.
A little research into the vintage hasn't proven the year, but according to wiring diagrams I've seen 67-69, it must be pre 67, as the wiring colours are different from what is shown in the 67 and 69 Body manuals. Although the colours differ, the function of the switch, relays, transmission and actuators are the same as post 67. Also, with some research, the colours on the passenger side cables confirm it to be from a full size GM. I feel this unit could be pre 65.
Dissasembling one side to get at the 3 actuators was easy. They all bolt in from the bottom. The horizontal drive gear is held tight against the gear rack with small tension spring on a pin. Be careful... misplace this spring and you'll probably have some play forward and aft. The top nuts on the front and rear vertical drives are removable despite the appearance of their ends being crimped. The 2 pins holding the 3 sections of the unit frame together are not removable. The rack and base feet slide right out one end and slide on 4 plastic shims. Be careful when sliding the rack out...they'll can pop out and run away! When broken down, the frame and rack assembly could be cleaned in a solvent tank and blasted. The arm section and feet appear to be raw steel, the rack is black painted. I'll blast and paint the rack and feet. Clean the main assembly.
On having a better look at the actuators, the reason was clear why nothing would drive. The grease had pretty much solidified! The good thing is the Vertical drives come apart easily. I could have bought one already restored, but this is far more fun!More to come.
Original, as found,
Some pictures..
Passenger side unit
Undeside, showing the rack and drive.
The top crimped nut on the vertical actuator. Probably never meant to come off. I'll clean the threads and use a high strength Locktitie when I reinstall them.
A veiw of the two vertical and one horizontal drive. The vertical drives are actually held together when bolted down. When removed the bearings and gears simply push out the bottom. The crosshafts slide out on plastic bearings.
The Horizontal drive cannot be dissasembled. Should be able to flush it out. Notice the crimped white plastic screw, I'm assuming that is the factory set backlash. The small spring is the horizontal tension spring. At first glance I'm actually very impressed by the precision parts in these units.
The bare main assembly and rack to the left. Notice the 4 slider shims.
I'll begin cleaning and rebuilding the drives soon.
Cheers, Mark
-- Edited by cdnpont on Saturday 29th of December 2012 09:59:41 PM
Today, I tested motor/ transmission and found one trans output constantly driving. Motor runs quiet and smooth.
The transmission functions as such; The input shaft comes into the case between the two larger gears driving them in the same direction. The third smaller gear is coupled to the center gear and runs opposite. All gears freewheel on their shafts whenever the motor runs. When energized, the tri solenoid assembly through which each gear shaft runs, drives a dog towards the gear, engaging with the gear dogs and driving the shaft. A spring disengages the dog when the solenoid is de energized. The dogs slide on a double flat section of the shaft and always turn with the shaft.
What I found was the upper gear in the picture has seized onto the shaft, and could not freewheel. This caused the shaft to spin regardless of the solenoid/dog actuation.
A complete cleaning was in order. What I though was rust on the shafts was actually petrified grease. Easily cleaned. Everything looked great inside. Again, I'm impressed with the quality and precision of the components inside this unit. Sadly you just cannot find this anymore...
Broken down into the components,
Don't forget the small plastic washer behind the dog. Notice the flats on the shaft and the shape of the inside diameter of the dog,
Clean, lightly greased and ready to close,
Time to test. No good switch, so a simple 3 way shunt is required. Used a 12 GA wire. I screwed the switch plug onto the bench so it would stay put. 6 tests..all good! Note; when the time come to run the entire assembly, a larger positive and negative wire will be needed. Just running with no load warms the small test leads. The big red lead is there for a reason! I labled the trans drives to make it easy to ensure the correct drives came on...they did!
Here's a schematic for testing. I think it covers most 6 way 60's seat side mounted switches. Just get power at the red, pick the motor forward or reverse, then choose your drive solenoid. Simple! The motor relay works perfect.
So the test was good. Now lets look at this sad switch.
It comes apart by simply depressing 4 tabs and easing the contact body out. Be carefull..the tabs can fly when they come out!
All pieces. Although it cannot be seen here, the center ball of the switch lever section is broken in half. Lever is missing.
Detail of the contact points. Dirty, corroded somewhat. Can they be fixed?
GM Schematic that I altered a bit. My wiring colour is to the left. The solenoid position in the the gear case is 1, 3, 2 on mine.
I understand now that separate swich components can be bought, but if from China...whats the point?
Interesting that GM made even the switch servicable!
Cheers, Mark
-- Edited by cdnpont on Monday 31st of December 2012 01:03:07 PM
That is a great presentation of pictures and text! You must be a pro at this stuff. I actually have one of these units for a bucket but I was afraid to touch it but with your pics it may just be a project. I picked up a good switch on ebay for not too much a while ago as mine was broken too if that helps.
Agreed Mark, great job on showing us your steps along the way. I don't even have a power seat but thoroughly enjoy following your thread. Thanks for that.
Agreed Mark, great job on showing us your steps along the way. I don't even have a power seat but thoroughly enjoy following your thread. Thanks for that.
X2.
You must have great patience, a steady hand, and a great natural intuition.
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Prince Edward Island
'64 Parisienne CS "barn find" - last on the road in '86 ... Owner Protection Plan booklet, original paint, original near-mint aqua interior, original aqua GM floor mats, original 283, factory posi, and original rust.
The power Stratobench for your car is in my favourite wrecking yard in Minnesosta, 3 hours south of me. I'll see how much he wants next trip. 67 Bonneville Brougham 4 door hardtop has it.
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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles
1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars
A little more progress. Front and back actuators are in. Big job cleaning everything, the old grease had petrified and basiacally turned solid. Used white lithium grease on the gears and packed the small bearings with wheel bearing grease. They turn super free now, as they were meant to.
I degreased the frames, then, instead of paint, I used CTC rust remover on them to keep the original metal look. Cleaned them off and used Tung oil to seal them (it dries clear and hard).
A little product plug here...Used Gunk Solder Seal "Hydro Seal" solvent to clean the tough stuff, Man this stuff works and you can reuse it. I'll let it settle out in the can for two days, pour it through a paint strainer and save it. Used it when I rebuilt a Qjet. Works like nothing else I've ever seen, has low odor, is thick and clings to parts but wipes off completly leaving no residue.
All the parts cleaned and ready to go, except the rack and horizontal actuators.
Together,
The Solvent,
-- Edited by cdnpont on Saturday 5th of January 2013 04:55:21 PM
'64 Parisienne CS "barn find" - last on the road in '86 ... Owner Protection Plan booklet, original paint, original near-mint aqua interior, original aqua GM floor mats, original 283, factory posi, and original rust.
I love bringing this stuff back Pascal! Perfect little task for the winter.
There was a guy from Northern Ontario, South River I think, that would restore and sell complete units on Ebay a few years ago.
They'd go for around $450. Bid on one but lost. So there is some money in it, but certainly no living.
But if any of us come across any units or parts in the wreckers, we should snag them before it's too late. Aside from a motor, switch and relay, I've never seen any replacement parts available for these things.
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65 Laurentian post, 67 Grande Parisienne 4 door HT.
It lives! HD video shot on my new Nikon J1 I got for xmas.
But now I've discovered the base of the tracks are shorter in length than "B" body tracks. Mine are 8 and 10". I've got a lead on another set and a switch on ebay.
I think I can just change the base...I have no clue what these are from, but the cable lengths are full size.
B Body,
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65 Laurentian post, 67 Grande Parisienne 4 door HT.
Can't you just do some welding on brackets to make this one fit your car? I know, I know, that would mess up your pretty seat track but at least you could use it if you did that.
Man, that thing looks good!
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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles
1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars
I think I might just add a piece to the base I have like you suggest above Carl.
Here's a little more detail on the switch,
As you can see, each switch section has two large contact points. They are the high current points for the motor drive, the relay trigger contacts are the small forked parts between the main points. The entire upper copper plate is powered through the switch feed pin. Push the switch, it contacts the copper plate, pushes that down onto the spring steel arm with the contact. Both then move down contacting the the small relay contact arm, then the upper contact connects with the lower main point. I imagine you get a little arc at the point each time it contacts and releases.
Remember using a older GM power seat...you fail to move the button just far enough, and all you hear is a slight "Click". Thats the solenoid relay picking up first. A little further pressure on the switch and the seat moves as full switch point contact is made. The relay point picks up just slightly before the motor, which makes sense, as you'd prefer that the trans dogs are engaged before the motor drives. It's my theory and I'm sticking to it!
I've repaired a few over the years with that hard grease you talk of. A good cleanup, new lithium grease and away they go again! Funny how that hard grease keeps it from engaging.
I never had to take a switch apart though. Nice explanation and detail on the switch guts. Nice to know.
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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles
1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars
The power Stratobench for your car is in my favourite wrecking yard in Minnesosta, 3 hours south of me. I'll see how much he wants next trip. 67 Bonneville Brougham 4 door hardtop has it.
I pulled the power track from the Bonneville on a trip south this weekend. I didn't have room to bring the whole seat home in the Fleetwood, or I would have! Now to rebuild it and then I will have a power Strato for the black car.
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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles
1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars
Awesome thread! I just bought a fairly complete power seat track off ebay. I'll be looking to re-grease the transmission and cables. Luckily, there are great pictures here and there is a diagram and in the 1967 Fisher Body manual. I'm a little intimidated with rebuilding or re-greasing the actuators. I'm hoping for a little hand-holding here.
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1967 Chevrolet Impala SS convertible - Ermine White C1 1967 Chevrolet Impala SS 396 - Marina Blue FF 1996 Chevrolet Caprice Classic LT1 2001 Ford F250 CC 4x4
The pictures show the internals of the actuators and transmission pretty well. All that's needed is to soak all the metal parts in some good solvent as I used. You'll find the grease has likely turned to solid wax.
Hand clean the plastic gears, I would probably not soak them long in any solvent.
The drive cables come apart, the inner cable will push out of the sheath, usually in one direction.
Good luck, and keep us posted.
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65 Laurentian post, 67 Grande Parisienne 4 door HT.
Hi All,
I finally rebuilt and installed the power seat track for Strato-Bench. Thanks to this thread, i encountered NO problems and it functions fabulously!! I still need to blast the side panel where the switches go. Then send that panel to the body shop to match the red paint.
Thanks again!!
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1967 Chevrolet Impala SS convertible - Ermine White C1 1967 Chevrolet Impala SS 396 - Marina Blue FF 1996 Chevrolet Caprice Classic LT1 2001 Ford F250 CC 4x4